Will the Model S/X have a spare tire & if not, how is that ok?

[jerry33]

I thought I would bump up this thread based on another thread regarding a similar discussion. Some people above had some interesting ideas: using a slightly smaller diameter tire on the front. Has anyone tried that yet? Any other creative solutions?

That is likely to play havoc with the vehicle stability control and ABS.

What about the run-flats? Is it true that they will reduce range, and if so, by how much?

Almost everyone who has cars equipped with run-flats takes them off--often long before they are worn out. I'd expect up to 20% range reduction but I don't have any real numbers. In my opinion, the best shot is to get a spare wheel and tire (and a good jack). Normally you don't carry these in the car except on trips. If you live where there is a real winter, then your spare is one of the four mounted snow tires that you should have, so you're not out anything extra (except the jack).

 

[4SUPER9]

That is likely to play havoc with the vehicle stability control and ABS.

Seems logical. I certainly do not want to be the first person to try this.

Almost everyone who has cars equipped with run-flats takes them off--often long before they are worn out. I'd expect up to 20% range reduction but I don't have any real numbers. In my opinion, the best shot is to get a spare wheel and tire (and a good jack). Normally you don't carry these in the car except on trips. If you live where there is a real winter, then your spare is one of the four mounted snow tires that you should have, so you're not out anything extra (except the jack).

20%!!! That kills this idea. Even if 10%. I guess I forgot about the jack. I imagine the MS would require something fairly heavy duty. I have one, but it's huge.

 

[jerry33]

I guess I forgot about the jack. I imagine the MS would require something fairly heavy duty. I have one, but it's huge.

Jacks like these are around 30-35 lbs.

 

[wycolo]

What are these people talking about?? Here is my 19in with a barely worn Blizzak snow stock size resting comfortably in Frunk:

And just to make it perfectly clear, the lid closes normally and no force was required to position rim/tire.
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[gene]

What are these people talking about?? Here is my 19in with a barely worn Blizzak snow stock size resting comfortably in Frunk:

View attachment 29738

And just to make it perfectly clear, the lid closes normally and no force was required to position rim/tire.
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What dimension is that tire? I have tried this with my oem 19" wheel and tire and and will not fit. My Model S is March 2013 manufacture, is it possible your Model S is newer and space has been redesigned in?

 

[wycolo]

> I have tried this with my oem 19" wheel and tire and and will not fit. [gene]

245/45R19 Bridgestone Blizzaks with 6300 miles on them. Took the top one off the stack, probably had been on the rear axle for all those miles. Sure has lots of tread left. Could these snows have deeper tread thus are built on squatter plies than the OEM summer tires? Call around for a well worn Blizzak that is on the trash pile, would be my suggestion. I plan on using them for a full second (6 month) winter.

My car left factory 7 Dec 2012. Note plastic piece coming down center from latch. Tire slides easily down that surface and keeps rug from getting messed up. TM is saying: this is where the spare goes!!

With the air suspension I should be able to use that tall jack in the photo. You will have to search for a low profile jack of some sort; Harbor Freight would be a good place to start. A squat bottle jack should be available for way under $600- LOL.

If your tire/rim won't fit in frunk then you can:

1. Remove tub - very easy to do.
2. Cut out the 2 rear corners to make more room for spare.
3. Seal the vertical openings with strips of fiberglass epoxyed into place.
4. Reassemble and even a new tire should then fit.
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[Cottonwood]

> I have tried this with my oem 19" wheel and tire and and will not fit. [gene]

245/45R19 Bridgestone Blizzaks with 6300 miles on them. Took the top one off the stack, probably had been on the rear axle for all those miles. Sure has lots of tread left. Could these snows have deeper tread thus are built on squatter plies than the OEM summer tires? Call around for a well worn Blizzak that is on the trash pile, would be my suggestion. I plan on using them for a full second (6 month) winter.

Here is a picture of my snow tire, Nokian Haka w/studs 245/45R19, in the Frunk with a Craftsman 2.5 ton floor jack in a plastic box, and a lug wrench. The lug wrench is wrapped in an old towel to avoid rattling. The tires have a few thousand miles on them from last winter, and this is an early Signature MS, delivered September 2012. Without the jack, the Frunk lid closes easily, with the jack, there is just the slightest additional pressure to close the lid. I will probably carve away some plastic on the front top of the jack case and the lid will then close easily.

As for space to get a jack under the car, with the tires inflated and normal height, I measured 5.5 inches from concrete floor to jack point. With the air suspension at "high," I measured 7". With the loss in height from a flat tire, I don't know how you would use a regular jack unless you rolled the flat wheel up on something. That is why I just got a small floor jack in a plastic box carrying case.

I won't use this setup for daily driving, but for long, cross-country trips, I think that it is prudent. I have already had one flat, fixed with Slime.

 

[4SUPER9]

Here is a picture of my snow tire, Nokian Haka w/studs 245/45R19, in the Frunk with a Craftsman 2.5 ton floor jack in a plastic box, and a lug wrench. The lug wrench is wrapped in an old towel to avoid rattling. The tires have a few thousand miles on them from last winter, and this is an early Signature MS, delivered September 2012. Without the jack, the Frunk lid closes easily, with the jack, there is just the slightest additional pressure to close the lid. I will probably carve away some plastic on the front top of the jack case and the lid will then close easily.

As for space to get a jack under the car, with the tires inflated and normal height, I measured 5.5 inches from concrete floor to jack point. With the air suspension at "high," I measured 7". With the loss in height from a flat tire, I don't know how you would use a regular jack unless you rolled the flat wheel up on something. That is why I just got a small floor jack in a plastic box carrying case.

I won't use this setup for daily driving, but for long, cross-country trips, I think that it is prudent. I have already had one flat, fixed with Slime.

This is really great information. Thank you. If you get a chance, give us the measurements of your frunk. I am interested to see if there is a difference from yours to later models like mine.

 

[derekt75]

I'm displeased.

I had a flat on Sunday afternoon.
I called Tesla roadside assistance.
They said that in 45 minutes, a tow truck would come and tow the car to the nearest service center (about 20 miles away). The service center was closed, so I'd need to wait a day to get the car back. What they said is what happened: the tow truck arrived in 40 minutes and towed the car to Sunnyvale, and the service center replaced the worn rear tires and delivered the car to me the next day.

The service center was closed on Sunday, so they couldn't offer me a rental car (not sure if they would have anyway). They offered to call a taxi for me, but we decided to just walk the two miles home.

The service center price for the Conti ExtremeContacts was $375, which is noticeably more than TireRack's $293. The service rep apologized and offered to let me have TireRack drop ship them to the service center, but I wanted my car back sooner rather than later, so I had to pay the Tesla price.

All told, I lost the use of my car for more than 24 hours due to a flat. We couldn't do what we wanted to do on Sunday because of a flat. My mother in law (in the car at the time) was asking why my fancy car didn't have a spare tire like every inexpensive car she's owned. I had to pay an extra $150 because Tesla charges more per tire than TireRack.

I'm sorry, but this is not "ok".
Yeah, the service people treated me nicely, but Tesla's decision to forgo any tire-fix options wound up being really annoying to me.
I bought a $100k car, but Tesla was too cheap to include their tire repair kit.
You could argue that it's my fault as I knew my car didn't have a spare, but somehow I figured that if I had a flat, it would get fixed faster than 24 hours.

I guess I'll buy the Fix-a-Flat Ultimate from Walmart, but the experience has left me with another sour note from Tesla.
I hate having to apologize to friends or relatives for why my car can't do a simple thing.

 

[JST]

I'm displeased.

I had a flat on Sunday afternoon.
I called Tesla roadside assistance.
They said that in 45 minutes, a tow truck would come and tow the car to the nearest service center (about 20 miles away). The service center was closed, so I'd need to wait a day to get the car back. What they said is what happened: the tow truck arrived in 40 minutes and towed the car to Sunnyvale, and the service center replaced the worn rear tires and delivered the car to me the next day.

The service center was closed on Sunday, so they couldn't offer me a rental car (not sure if they would have anyway). They offered to call a taxi for me, but we decided to just walk the two miles home.

The service center price for the Conti ExtremeContacts was $375, which is noticeably more than TireRack's $293. The service rep apologized and offered to let me have TireRack drop ship them to the service center, but I wanted my car back sooner rather than later, so I had to pay the Tesla price.

All told, I lost the use of my car for more than 24 hours due to a flat. We couldn't do what we wanted to do on Sunday because of a flat. My mother in law (in the car at the time) was asking why my fancy car didn't have a spare tire like every inexpensive car she's owned. I had to pay an extra $150 because Tesla charges more per tire than TireRack.

I'm sorry, but this is not "ok".
Yeah, the service people treated me nicely, but Tesla's decision to forgo any tire-fix options wound up being really annoying to me.
I bought a $100k car, but Tesla was too cheap to include their tire repair kit.
You could argue that it's my fault as I knew my car didn't have a spare, but somehow I figured that if I had a flat, it would get fixed faster than 24 hours.

I guess I'll buy the Fix-a-Flat Ultimate from Walmart, but the experience has left me with another sour note from Tesla.
I hate having to apologize to friends or relatives for why my car can't do a simple thing.

Putting aside potential space-saver spare options (which I've not been able to investigate yet), one thing you could do would be to get an extra wheel and tire and just keep it in your garage. That way a flat would mean getting it trucked home, but at least you could swap the wheel at home while you waited for the other to be fixed.

I completely agree that the trend in cars toward no spare tires is ridiculous, and I've gone to some lengths to source spares for all the cars I've owned that didn't come with them (a couple of M3s and a Boxster). I've only had to use one once, but having that spare in my M3 was the difference between a minor inconvenience and a major PITA. I'm going to try and source a spare for the Tesla as soon as I get the car.

 

[EdA]

I'm displeased.

I had a flat on Sunday afternoon.
I called Tesla roadside assistance.
They said that in 45 minutes, a tow truck would come and tow the car to the nearest service center (about 20 miles away). The service center was closed, so I'd need to wait a day to get the car back. What they said is what happened: the tow truck arrived in 40 minutes and towed the car to Sunnyvale, and the service center replaced the worn rear tires and delivered the car to me the next day.

The service center was closed on Sunday, so they couldn't offer me a rental car (not sure if they would have anyway). They offered to call a taxi for me, but we decided to just walk the two miles home.

The service center price for the Conti ExtremeContacts was $375, which is noticeably more than TireRack's $293. The service rep apologized and offered to let me have TireRack drop ship them to the service center, but I wanted my car back sooner rather than later, so I had to pay the Tesla price.

All told, I lost the use of my car for more than 24 hours due to a flat. We couldn't do what we wanted to do on Sunday because of a flat. My mother in law (in the car at the time) was asking why my fancy car didn't have a spare tire like every inexpensive car she's owned. I had to pay an extra $150 because Tesla charges more per tire than TireRack.

I'm sorry, but this is not "ok".
Yeah, the service people treated me nicely, but Tesla's decision to forgo any tire-fix options wound up being really annoying to me.
I bought a $100k car, but Tesla was too cheap to include their tire repair kit.
You could argue that it's my fault as I knew my car didn't have a spare, but somehow I figured that if I had a flat, it would get fixed faster than 24 hours.

I guess I'll buy the Fix-a-Flat Ultimate from Walmart, but the experience has left me with another sour note from Tesla.
I hate having to apologize to friends or relatives for why my car can't do a simple thing.

Was it a blow out or a nail? Would a plug repair kit or the goo have helped?

 

[Forty Creek]

The Model S (and, likely Model X) does not ship with a spare. To save weight, it comes only with a tire repair kit. The assumption is that you'll have, and use, roadside assistance.

Some on these boards have indicated that they'll stow a spare in the frunk, together with a jack.

...and it doesn't ship in every market with the tire repair kit. In Canada, it must be purchased separately.

 

[derekt75]

Was it a blow out or a nail? Would a plug repair kit or the goo have helped?

The service center didn't tell me.
I wasn't actually in the car at the time. (I arrived in a 2-seater to get my mother-in-law, but my baby can't ride in my airbag-enabled roadster (stupid Benz BabySmart system)).
According to my wife, she didn't hit any thing, and there was no reason [e.g., pothole] to suspect a flat. However tire pressure went from no warning to totally flat in a matter of seconds.
The sidewall looked fine.

 

[derekt75]

I was thinking about this some more...

My car was sitting disabled in the middle of a Sunday for nearly an hour at the entrance to a country club with over 1500 homes. My disabled car was also visible to a busy 2-lane in each direction street that feeds an affluent community. It's entirely possible that someone seeing my disabled car would choose not to purchase a Tesla after that. Add that intangible cost to the intangible cost of an owner being frustrated and to the tangible cost of towing my car to Sunnyvale and back ($200?), and it's hard for me to understand why Tesla wouldn't want to ship their cars with a $30 Fix-A-Flat system.

Shipping without a Fix-A-Flat system is simply a penny-wise pound-foolish business decision.

 

[EdA]

I was thinking about this some more...

My car was sitting disabled in the middle of a Sunday for nearly an hour at the entrance to a country club with over 1500 homes. My disabled car was also visible to a busy 2-lane in each direction street that feeds an affluent community. It's entirely possible that someone seeing my disabled car would choose not to purchase a Tesla after that. Add that intangible cost to the intangible cost of an owner being frustrated and to the tangible cost of towing my car to Sunnyvale and back ($200?), and it's hard for me to understand why Tesla wouldn't want to ship their cars with a $30 Fix-A-Flat system.

Shipping without a Fix-A-Flat system is simply a penny-wise pound-foolish business decision.

The problem is jacking up the car.

I kept my AAA for the rare times I drive the other ICE cars in my family.
I also keep a repair kit in the car.

 

[liuping]

I was thinking about this some more...

My car was sitting disabled in the middle of a Sunday for nearly an hour at the entrance to a country club with over 1500 homes. My disabled car was also visible to a busy 2-lane in each direction street that feeds an affluent community. It's entirely possible that someone seeing my disabled car would choose not to purchase a Tesla after that. Add that intangible cost to the intangible cost of an owner being frustrated and to the tangible cost of towing my car to Sunnyvale and back ($200?), and it's hard for me to understand why Tesla wouldn't want to ship their cars with a $30 Fix-A-Flat system.

Shipping without a Fix-A-Flat system is simply a penny-wise pound-foolish business decision.

If fix-a-flat would have fixed the problem, then they could have just plugged/patched the hole, instead of replacing the whole tire. That combined with it loosing all pressure withing seconds, means it was probably more than a simple puncture.

For a simple puncture, I'd avoid Fix-a-Flat slime type systems, as it's likely to mess up your TPMS and add $$ to the repair costs. I'd use a simple plug repair kit (http://www.griotsgarage.com/product/tire+repair+kit+with+12+volt+air+compressor.do) and drive it to some place like Discount Tire for a full repair inspection. Or just have it towed there directly without patching it.

 

[derekt75]

If fix-a-flat would have fixed the problem, then they could have just plugged/patched the hole, instead of replacing the whole tire.

After 11k miles the tire had very little tread on it anyway. When I called I told them that I needed to replace the tire regardless of the type of failure. After looking at the tires, they agreed that the rear tires needed to be changed.

 

[derekt75]

I was thinking about this some more...

My car was sitting disabled in the middle of a Sunday for nearly an hour at the entrance to a country club with over 1500 homes. My disabled car was also visible to a busy 2-lane in each direction street that feeds an affluent community. It's entirely possible that someone seeing my disabled car would choose not to purchase a Tesla after that. Add that intangible cost to the intangible cost of an owner being frustrated and to the tangible cost of towing my car to Sunnyvale and back ($200?), and it's hard for me to understand why Tesla wouldn't want to ship their cars with a $30 Fix-A-Flat system.

Shipping without a Fix-A-Flat system is simply a penny-wise pound-foolish business decision.

I sent ownership@teslamotors a modified version of the above.
Their response:

Thank you very much for your feedback and interest in Tesla Motors. We are always looking for ways to improve Model S. We found that most flat tire repair kits that are available offered limited utility to Model S. Instead, we felt that focusing our resources on a 24/7 Roadside Assistance service would be a greater benefit to Model S owners.

I am happy to pass on your suggestion to the appropriate teams here at our corporate office.

 

[ribsandbbqbeef]

Where can I buy a single standard 19" wheel sans tire without having to buy an entire set of 4 that's being sold on Tesla's online store?

 

[wycolo]

> The problem is jacking up the car. [EdA]

Turns out NOT to be the problem I assumed it would be using a common everyday lightweight sissor jack. In the past I have used these handy jacks to lower the MS but assumed the MS was too heavy to be raised by them. Not so as it turns out, since when you begin jacking at LOW level the jack does not to lift much weight at all. By the time the jack assumes ALL the weight the force multiplier is much greater due to the geometry of the sizzors.

Be sure the sizzor jack you use is in 'new' condition and is clean and lubed. Then get a short length of hardwood flooring which usually has that routed-out groove on the under-side. That groove is where the curved top surface of the GM-style jack goes. This keeps it centered on the wood as the angle changes as the car is jacked up. Or simply receives the 'pin' on the top of sizzor jack that has a fully floating top piece (Ford, Subaru). BOTH styles of sizzor jacks will work for the MS. And the wood spreads the weight nicely over the plastic contact pad on the MS rocker.

Any wrecking yard can get you a mint sizzor jack for cheap. Ask for one out of a V6 or larger car. Also get a piece of 1/2 inch plywood to use under the jack on soft earth.
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