7.1 AutoPilot Nag

[garygid]

The hands-on-wheel requirement is not to detect if the driver is alive or awake,
so touching other controls should not inhibit the autosteering nag. Instead,
detecting what appears to be hands on the steering wheel inhibits the nag.

Only with your hands actually on the wheel can you detect an inappropriate
steering effort and override it BEFORE the car jogs enough to hit a nearby object.
The Beta Auto-Steering software is not yet ready for autonomous (hands off)
driving, so Tesla is telling us, in many ways, to keep our hands on the wheel.

 

[Mark Z]

...Only with your hands actually on the wheel can you detect an inappropriate steering effort and override it BEFORE the car jogs enough to hit a nearby object. The Beta Auto-Steering software is not yet ready for autonomous (hands off) driving, so Tesla is telling us, in many ways, to keep our hands on the wheel.

I totally agree.

IMHO, the latest 7.1 software seems to turn off AP more often in traffic, making it necessary to be ready to take over in a moment of time.

 

[DCGOO]

I'm usually looking at the road, not the down at the screen, so I was typically reminded every 5 minutes (at least) to touch the wheel by an annoying pause in whatever I was listening to.

It is supposed to do that. If you don't want it to nag, then leave your hands on the wheel. That is the idea.

 

[Electroman]

I never drove in 7.0, only in 7.1 and I don't feel the nag is in any way obtrusive or makes the AP any less desirable. In other words I don't feel the prompt as in any way as nagging

 

[wk057]

After driving around with default settings with the autopilot developer display showing, I've concluded that the nag definitely depends on how Tesla's navigation classifies the road. Something like I-40 or I-95 gets a class of 1 and the road in my residential development gets a class of 5. On class 1 roads the nag seems to be mostly like it was in V7, generally non-existent. Class 2 roads is where the timed nag seems to start to come into play. These seem to be well traveled divided highways that aren't branded as interstate highways, such as the Long Island Expressway, NC Hwy 321, Baltimore-Washington Parkway, the Garden State Parkway, Atlantic City Expressway, etc, regardless of the speed limit. Roads higher than class 2 get the +5 MPH restriction it seems too, but the nag is worse as class increases (higher class, smaller road, supposedly).

And, as expected, it seems that the class number isn't always correct. For example, it classifies the private road in this video as class 1, likely due to its proximity to the interstate. It is on the map, though, much like private mall roads and such. The road in this video comes up as class 4 (just a middle of no-where country road).

 

[Cyberax]

It is supposed to do that. If you don't want it to nag, then leave your hands on the wheel. That is the idea.

Except that I keep my hands on the wheel all the time. Yet Tesla fails to register it.

 

[dpodoll]

Except that I keep my hands on the wheel all the time. Yet Tesla fails to register it.

It needs to feel slight resistance from you when it turns the wheel. Disengages at 4lb resistance.

 

[Cyberax]

It needs to feel slight resistance from you when it turns the wheel. Disengages at 4lb resistance.

This really defeats the whole purpose of AP. I'm considering taping a lead weight to the wheel...

 

[wk057]

I'm actually unsure if using a weight would actually work, since it'd be static, just as if the car was always pulling to one side or another due to road curvature or an alignment issue... it will likely ignore it. Has anyone actually tried this on a Model S/X? Not suggesting it be done, just curious.

 

[Trailblazer]

After driving around with default settings with the autopilot developer display showing, I've concluded that the nag definitely depends on how Tesla's navigation classifies the road. Something like I-40 or I-95 gets a class of 1 and the road in my residential development gets a class of 5. On class 1 roads the nag seems to be mostly like it was in V7, generally non-existent. Class 2 roads is where the timed nag seems to start to come into play. These seem to be well traveled divided highways that aren't branded as interstate highways, such as the Long Island Expressway, NC Hwy 321, Baltimore-Washington Parkway, the Garden State Parkway, Atlantic City Expressway, etc, regardless of the speed limit. Roads higher than class 2 get the +5 MPH restriction it seems too, but the nag is worse as class increases (higher class, smaller road, supposedly).

And, as expected, it seems that the class number isn't always correct. For example, it classifies the private road in this video as class 1, likely due to its proximity to the interstate. It is on the map, though, much like private mall roads and such. The road in this video comes up as class 4 (just a middle of no-where country road).

Thanks for that research - that makes a lot of sense. I just couldn't figure out why so many people are insisting that 7.1 introduced timed nags and even a poorer AP experience than 7.0. My own experience is that 7.1 AP is slightly better than 7.0 AP - the nagging seems roughly the same to me and I have never really noticed any ping-ponging. But I am primarily using autopilot on I-77 in the Carolinas, so perhaps that's a class 1 road.

 

[wk057]

Thanks for that research - that makes a lot of sense. I just couldn't figure out why so many people are insisting that 7.1 introduced timed nags and even a poorer AP experience than 7.0. My own experience is that 7.1 AP is slightly better than 7.0 AP - the nagging seems roughly the same to me and I have never really noticed any ping-ponging. But I am primarily using autopilot on I-77 in the Carolinas, so perhaps that's a class 1 road.

Yep, I-77 shows as class 1. I drive it frequently enough myself.

 

[drsaab]

I'm actually unsure if using a weight would actually work, since it'd be static, just as if the car was always pulling to one side or another due to road curvature or an alignment issue... it will likely ignore it. Has anyone actually tried this on a Model S/X? Not suggesting it be done, just curious.

Yes it does 100%

 

[MarkS22]

After driving around with default settings with the autopilot developer display showing, I've concluded that the nag definitely depends on how Tesla's navigation classifies the road. Something like I-40 or I-95 gets a class of 1 and the road in my residential development gets a class of 5. On class 1 roads the nag seems to be mostly like it was in V7, generally non-existent. Class 2 roads is where the timed nag seems to start to come into play. These seem to be well traveled divided highways that aren't branded as interstate highways, such as the Long Island Expressway, NC Hwy 321, Baltimore-Washington Parkway, the Garden State Parkway, Atlantic City Expressway, etc, regardless of the speed limit. Roads higher than class 2 get the +5 MPH restriction it seems too, but the nag is worse as class increases (higher class, smaller road, supposedly).

And, as expected, it seems that the class number isn't always correct. For example, it classifies the private road in this video as class 1, likely due to its proximity to the interstate. It is on the map, though, much like private mall roads and such. The road in this video comes up as class 4 (just a middle of no-where country road).

Other than being in a developer setting, are you aware of any way for someone to determine the class of a road? I'm wondering if they're pulling from a database that's searchable somewhere online.

 

[davidc18]

I'm actually unsure if using a weight would actually work, since it'd be static, just as if the car was always pulling to one side or another due to road curvature or an alignment issue... it will likely ignore it. Has anyone actually tried this on a Model S/X? Not suggesting it be done, just curious.

Yes, 100% effective.

 

[Soolim]

Yes, 100% effective.

Maybe true, but if Tesla wants to defeat this cheating, they can also do so easily. Human holding wheel is not static, adding weight is.

 

[wk057]

Other than being in a developer setting, are you aware of any way for someone to determine the class of a road? I'm wondering if they're pulling from a database that's searchable somewhere online.

Good question. I don't know of a way to do this outside of the dev readouts or for an arbitrary road. There *is* a CAN message on the chassis bus for the current road class that I haven't identified yet (my focus has been the power train bus), so that would be accessible without dev mode, technically.

 

[green1]

Other than being in a developer setting, are you aware of any way for someone to determine the class of a road? I'm wondering if they're pulling from a database that's searchable somewhere online.

My suspicion is that this data is from the mapping database (navigon) and is therefore likely HIGHLY flawed. As for how to search it, that's a bit more of a problem as it's not as simple as "Searching" their database.

 

[slevit1md]

On class 1 roads the nag seems to be mostly like it was in V7, generally non-existent. Class 2 roads is where the timed nag seems to start to come into play. These seem to be well traveled divided highways that aren't branded as interstate highways, such as the Long Island Expressway, NC Hwy 321, Baltimore-Washington Parkway, the Garden State Parkway, Atlantic City Expressway, etc, regardless of the speed limit. Roads higher than class 2 get the +5 MPH restriction it seems too, but the nag is worse as class increases (higher class, smaller road, supposedly).

Very interesting, I suppose I have't found any of these class 1 roads yet. Seems the Ohio Turnpike ought to be class 1, but it apparently isn't since I'm getting the nag every 5 minutes. I have yet to try autopilot on the back country roads that I have to take to one of the locations I rarely work at, but I'm hoping those are incorrectly classified as Class 2! The speed limit on the primary road I drive on there is 55 or 60, I typically go 10 over, and it would be pretty annoying if the speed is limited there to 5 over. The nag, which I'm sure will be present, will also be annoying, but I guess I'll have to just deal with that for now. I'm sure quite a few of us would be very grateful if you'd show us how to do whatever it is you're doing!

 

[AWDtsla]

After several weeks of living with 7.1, I don't see how the nag can be prioritized an issue. I have to grab the wheel often enough to take over, or stop the car from weaving possibly in the presence of 50, the nag is the least of the autopilot problems.

 

[Fiebrudo]

Today, the nag drove me crazy. Same major highway I drive everyday, mostly straight. Was "nagged" every 2 to 3 minutes for more than 20 minutes. No relation whatsoever with driving conditions.

I'm so disappointed, makes me sick to witness how Tesla lawyers have ruined the experience.

Cant figure out if this behavior is random or what is going on.