ALL CyberTruck discussion

[KarenRei]

So Elektrek quotes Tesla as saying this in a filing:

"Further, Tesla just recently announced the development of its first pickup truck, the Cybertruck"

By saying, "first", is this an implicit acknowledgement of more pickups to come? All of us here probably expected Tesla to fill in the gaps and electrify the entire truck range, in fulfillment of its mission...

https://ww.electrek.co/2019/12/13/tesla-cybertruck-medium-duty-vehicle-carb/

Musk has already talked about other variants (such as a smaller one) on Twitter after the Cybertruck launch.

One pickup model cannot meet the whole market. There's a significant amount of variation in truck needs. Once they've started saturating the market for the current Cybertruck, they'll start making others.

 

[StealthP3D]

So Elektrek quotes Tesla as saying this in a filing:

"Further, Tesla just recently announced the development of its first pickup truck, the Cybertruck"

By saying, "first", is this an implicit acknowledgement of more pickups to come? All of us here probably expected Tesla to fill in the gaps and electrify the entire truck range, in fulfillment of its mission...

https://ww.electrek.co/2019/12/13/tesla-cybertruck-medium-duty-vehicle-carb/

No. Tesla's "first pickup truck" simply means Tesla has never released any other pickup. This is a first. I would caution against reading more into it than that. I don't expect Tesla to make ANY other pickup truck for at least 5 years.

 

[humbaba]

So Elektrek quotes Tesla as saying this in a filing:

"Further, Tesla just recently announced the development of its first pickup truck, the Cybertruck"

By saying, "first", is this an implicit acknowledgement of more pickups to come? All of us here probably expected Tesla to fill in the gaps and electrify the entire truck range, in fulfillment of its mission...

https://ww.electrek.co/2019/12/13/tesla-cybertruck-medium-duty-vehicle-carb/

On its face it is just phrasing that points out the distinction from prior vehicles which were all cars. While it could be interpreted as 'first of multiple trucks' that is reading into it. Yes, they also announced the semi, but that is seen as a commercial vehicle and not in the same class as other Tesla vehicles, including cybertruck.

So, yes, that reading isn't wrong, but that doesn't make it right. I'd be conservative, especially as you are quoting electrek which is not a Tesla mouthpiece. The author was just writing a sentence.

 

[avoigt]

Perhaps Google Translate is missing some subtleties because I don't see the problem with what he said. Big battery EV acceleration is limited by traction, not cell chemistry, right?

And what does Maxwell have to do with acceleration? You don't think Tesla is putting ultracaps in mass production vehicles, do you?

The torque of an electric engine means nothing if you have a battery technology that does not allow you to therefore is statement reveals him not understanding the drive train of a BEV. Maxwell enables better energy peak output.

That discussion should not belong here but you may want to read in other treats if interested to learn about it.

No offense but what Blume stated is quite an embarrassment for a Porsche CEO.

 

[Nocturnal]

No. Tesla's "first pickup truck" simply means Tesla has never released any other pickup. This is a first. I would caution against reading more into it than that. I don't expect Tesla to make ANY other pickup truck for at least 5 years.

If I had to guess I'd say the next models will be something like a small sedan (model 1?) and maybe something to address the delivery/van/work vehicle market. The Cybertruck will meet the needs of what, 80% of pick up owners? That other 20% is not only a small chunk, but will be far more difficult to compete in vs large diesels.

 

[Oil4AsphaultOnly]

Indeed:
Alternative Fuels Data Center: Maps and Data - Vehicle Weight Classes & Categories

"The vehicle weight classes are defined by FHWA and are used consistently throughout the industry. These classes, 1-8, are based on gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR), the maximum weight of the vehicle, as specified by the manufacturer. GVWR includes total vehicle weight plus fluids, passengers, and cargo"

Just subtracting payload alone reduces the possible range of empty masses to 5000-6500 lbs (2,27-2,95t). Subtract maybe 1300lbs / 600kg more max for passengers. (3700-4300lbs / 1,68-1,95t)

*SHOCK!!!* Is this proof that KarenRei is more than one person?!?!

The trucker grrl side would've known that cargo capacity includes passenger mass, so we have a real world guesstimate of 5000-6500lbs for the cybertruck. So still somewhere within the weight of the modelX.

 

[Artful Dodger]

Deutsche Bank released another report today. Cybertruck:

The battery pack sizes for the Cybertruck were not disclosed but Tesla believes that they can achieve the targeted ranges and price points with the current generation of batteries.

There you go, all you dreamers and pixies. Tesla plans to build the 3 announced versions of Cybertruck with EXISTING battery packs, according to information revealed to Deutsche Bank.

There will be no reinventing tech that's already GOODENOUGH.

As if it was ever going to be any thing else, with Elon's word's from Master Plan: Part Deux driving home the message:

"What really matters to accelerate a sustainable future is being able to scale up production volume as quickly as possible."​

Trying to build custom bty packs for Cybertruck is a waste of precious time. Powertrains (bty, pwr electronics, motors) will be adapted with MINIMUM necessary changes to fit Cybertruck as follows:

• Model 3 RWD LR ==> $39.9k 2wd Cybertruck
• Model S AWD LR ==> $49.9k 4wd Cybertruck
• Model S/X PLAID ==> $69.9k Tri-mtr (look for Plaid specs Summer 2020)

 

[MP3Mike]

There you go, all you dreamers and pixies. Tesla plans to build the 3 announced versions of Cybertruck with EXISTING battery packs, according to information revealed to Deutsche Bank.

It did not say existing packs... I can guarantee they aren't going to use the existing packs since the can't be double stacked.

 

[doghousePVD]

There you go, all you dreamers and pixies. Tesla plans to build the 3 announced versions of Cybertruck with EXISTING battery packs, according to information revealed to Deutsche Bank.

There will be no reinventing tech that's already GOODENOUGH.

As if it was ever going to be any thing else, with Elon's word's from Master Plan: Part Deux driving home the message:

"What really matters to accelerate a sustainable future is being able to scale up production volume as quickly as possible."​

Trying to build custom bty packs for Cybertruck is a waste of precious time. Powertrains (bty, pwr electronics, motors) will be adapted with MINIMUM necessary changes to fit Cybertruck as follows:

• Model 3 RWD LR ==> $39.9k 2wd Cybertruck
• Model S AWD LR ==> $49.9k 4wd Cybertruck
• Model S/X PLAID ==> $69.9k Tri-mtr (look for Plaid specs Summer 2020)

"Current generation of batteries" says nothing about battery packs. Obviously a pickup cannot go 500+ miles with a 100 kWh battery if a more aerodynamic X can't even do 400. Put enough current generation battery cells in a pack, and one can make a 1000 kWh pack for a Semi.

 

[kbM3]

... the drive train of a BEV. Maxwell enables better energy peak output.

That discussion should not belong here but you may want to read in other treats if interested to learn about it.

No offense but what Blume stated is quite an embarrassment for a Porsche CEO.

I assume you meant better peak power (kW) not energy (kWh) output?

 

[ggr]

Mod: @Johnny Ma threw a hissy because a moderator (me) deleted his post in the wrong thread. If anyone really cares, here is his reservation number: RN113172901 --ggr

 

[RobStark]

For European CT reservation holders that want the complete American Full Size TRuck experience.

Cybertruck Nuts - Truck Nuts for Tesla Cybertruck

 

[JRP3]

Going through your questions, while attempting to keep this Investor related.

TL;dr its about the SPEED of bringing a new class of products to production

1. Deutsche Bank, in a Research Note from Dec 13th, quoted Tesla IR Director Martin Viecha as saying that Cybertruck can be built with the current generation of batteries.

2. "The battery pack sizes for the Cybertruck were not disclosed but Tesla believes that they can achieve the targeted ranges and price points with the current generation of batteries."​

There are 2 packs currently in production: Models S/X and 3. Plaid//Tri-motor must be built up from existing generations. It isn't going to get any clearer than that. Of course you are free to believe what you choose, but my point is that Tesla's choices will:

• use the simplest path to Cybertruck production
• utilize existing production capacity resources
  
• minimize CapEx for the first 3 pickup versions

(3) Initial battery cells for $50K AWD Cyber/Raven will most likely come from Japan because its simplest to do so. There is existing idle capacity on GA1 due to the 2019 reduction in Model S/X production, so it minimizes CapEx. As I stated, we'll have to wait for Bty Day to find out Tesla's plans for large scale production (over 1K/wk).

Perhaps by 2022 when the $40K Cybertruck becomes available, there will be surplus capacity for 2170 cells. That may be why Tesla delayed that version, since right now every $40K 2WD Cybertruck produced would come at the loss of a $45K Model 3 LR not produced due to lack of battery cells.

(4) Both Raven motors DO NOT come from Fremont (but you knew the front SRPM motor is made at GF1 and shipped to Fremont for assembly, right?)

In summary, using the 18650-based 100 KWh Raven AWD powertrain from the current S/X is the simply the fastest path to launch a new class of products for Tesla, while accelerating the Mission. Since everything beyond what Tesla has announced is speculation (especially Plaid/Tri-motor), let's agree to disagree and end this here.

Cheers!

Once again you've provided no proof to back your speculation or counter mine.
1. Current generation of batteries includes Model 3 packs.
2. Plaid/Tri-motor uses at least one, probably two PMSR motors built at GF1. Induction motor can be shipped to GF1 from Fremont, much cheaper than shipping battery packs from GF1 to Fremont.
3. Simplest and most cost effective is using GF1 built packs.
4. See #2 above.

 

[pz1975]

OT but wanted to share a pic of the birthday cake my wife got for me tonight.

 

[PACEMD]

View attachment 489912 OT but wanted to share a pic of the birthday cake my wife got for me tonight.

Sweet! But what happens if you throw a cannonball at it?

 

[jebinc]

View attachment 489912 OT but wanted to share a pic of the birthday cake my wife got for me tonight.

Keep that wife for a happy life!

 

[ZsoZso]

Apparently it's not too hard to make a knock-off Cybertruck

Looks like Russia already has a cyber truck

 

[lascavarian]

So when the tri-motor truck got moved forward it moved forward higher volume production of the rear dual motor drive unit.

I propose that positive experience with the dual motor drive unit will result in Tesla dropping the single motor/differential RWD configuration. Soon the dual motor RWD drive unit will be a popular configuration.

1. This transitions the inefficient mechanical differential into more efficient SW where improvements in regen, handling, performance and durability can be realized across all model lines simply by improving SW.

2. Linking FSD NN path prediction into a SW based differential further advances handling and regen.

3. Thermal management opportunities are improved. (Probably towing performance as well)

4. This allows the same dual motor drive unit to be used in the front which brings Tesla into a true 4 motor configuration sooner further advancing improvements in regen, handling, performance and durability while simplifying production options.

 

[JRP3]

I doubt there will be any meaningful improvement in regen. The existing limit on regen is the cell level charge acceptance rate.

 

[winfield100]

So when the tri-motor truck got moved forward it moved forward higher volume production of the rear dual motor drive unit.

I propose that positive experience with the dual motor drive unit will result in Tesla dropping the single motor/differential RWD configuration. Soon the dual motor RWD drive unit will be a popular configuration.

1. This transitions the inefficient mechanical differential into more efficient SW where improvements in regen, handling, performance and durability can be realized across all model lines simply by improving SW.

2. Linking FSD NN path prediction into a SW based differential further advances handling and regen.

3. Thermal management opportunities are improved. (Probably towing performance as well)

4. This allows the same dual motor drive unit to be used in the front which brings Tesla into a true 4 motor configuration sooner further advancing improvements in regen, handling, performance and durability while simplifying production options.

@lascavarian
I demur a bit.

I still want my “ mobile 5 powerwalls with almost free truck” as a base for a nascent VPP here in SW Florida, where hurricane Irma took out the grid for a number of days in a city of 250,000 based upon no electric for that time.

Look at the size of hurricane Andrew, 1982
Look at the size of hurricane Irma, 2017, at least 4x larger, both category 5

A simple hallucination
100 or some number cybertrucks pulling some mega packs on trailers somewhere needed
Instant power plant.
They are definitely going to need to up GW output of those batteries