Welcome to Tesla Motors Club
Discuss Tesla's Model S, Model 3, Model X, Model Y, Cybertruck, Roadster and More.
Register

Are winter tires necessary with the long range dual motor AWD?

Are winter snow sires with AWD Model 3 needed?

  • I am comfortable with the stock tires handling in the snow.

    Votes: 40 23.1%
  • I am NOT comfortable with the stock tires handling in the snow.

    Votes: 12 6.9%
  • I have experience driving in snow with and without snow tires feel the snow tires are worth it.

    Votes: 106 61.3%
  • I have experience driving in snow with and without snow tires feel the snow tires NOT worth it.

    Votes: 15 8.7%

  • Total voters
    173
This site may earn commission on affiliate links.
Thanks for the info on these tires, I'm getting 19's so I'll keep this in mind. A few questions for those of you who do this...
Where do you take them to get balanced and mounted, and what is the approximate cost?
How do you transport the tires? Do they all fit in the back of the 3?
Where do you store them? I have limited garage space.
Thanks!

Tire Rack will ship them to an installer for you (they have you pick from a list and show you the cost of each), but for me it was $92 at the shop I selected. I think the tires will fit with the seats down, but I'm not 100% sure... guess I'll find out! As for storing them, I'll either put them in a storage room at my house or my buddy who has a big shed that's currently empty said I could store them there if needed.
 
I'm certain without reading the thread that this has been beat to death, however I impulsively must add my two cents.

AWD helps you go forward faster, and in bad conditions may assist with un-stucking oneself at low speeds or even very low speed turning. However stopping, turning, and highway-speed maneuvers do not benefit from AWD in any way. The only way you can help this is to increase your friction with the road surface by getting tires that are better for it.

My experience (FWD, RWD, and 4WD vehicles) says winter tires make a huge difference on slushy, icy, or compact snow roads. Slush is universally terrible and will screw you over hard if you hit it wrong, but proper tires help. Cold road surfaces are better traversed with winter tires as well, you should see a noticeable improvement in braking even without the frozen water stuff.

Anyone that says all-seasons are just fine in sub-zero conditions with frozen water bits (snow, slush, ice) are potentially not incorrect, given the word "fine". However, dedicated winter tires are universally better in these situations, and I certainly would recommend the extra control over the car.
 
Oh for Pete's sake I can't believe this! I lived in Minnesota for nearly twenty years drove my car's none of which were all wheel drive ( I'm talking rear wheel drive Lincoln Town cars rear on all-season radials including my 2 wheel drive pickup. Snow tires are not needed unless you don't know how to drive in adverse winter conditions, or you're an idiot. particularly with an all wheel drive car a good all-season radial should be more than enough for most any condition you would drive in and if it's really that bad you probably shouldn't be out there driving anyway.
 
Last edited:
Yeah, the problem with "those days" is everyone else you have to deal with and sometimes it doesn't matter if you have control or not.
Another Colorado story:

I was driving too fast in nasty ice conditions on a highway in the Model 3 with OEM all seasons when a semi pulled into my lane about 50 feet in front of me. Braking slowed my car but it was obvious that was not going to be enough to avoid collision. I was fortunate that the tyres had enough grip to let me safely swerve to the shoulder of the road and not lose control.
 
Oh for Pete's sake I can't believe this! I lived in Minnesota for nearly twenty years drove my car's none of which were all wheel drive ( I'm talking rear wheel drive Lincoln Town cars rear on all-season radials including my 2 wheel drive pickup. Snow tires are not needed unless you don't know how to drive in adverse winter conditions, or you're an idiot. particularly with an all wheel drive car a good all-season radial should be more than enough for most any condition you would drive in and if it's really that bad you probably shouldn't be out there driving anyway.

How many low salt areas were there around back then?

How many tons did that town car weigh?

Were your tires low rolling resistance tires?

Yeah, we’re all idiots.
 
but does not help you brake or turn.
Well AWD does help with that, too. It is just that winter tires over all seasons tends to help a whole lot more, in an additive way on top of the AWD benefit. Especially, as others have pointed out, the further the temperature drops.

Whether it is appropriate or necessary to swap out all seasons for winter tires is a multi-variable thing well past "is there snow?"
 
Last edited:
How do EVs stop better than ICE vehicles in snowy conditions?
I live in Front Range Colorado and know one small but significant rule of thumb driving in snow no matter what vehicle or tires you have= Drive slow. EVs torque makes it act like a grip in the icy snow I learned that driving 2013 Leaf. My RWD model 3 is 15 months young and it has more winter driving features than Leaf like Chill Mode, Low regen etc-I did not bother to switch to winter tires last winter-it drives like a champ.
 
  • Funny
Reactions: Daniel in SD
I live in Front Range Colorado and know one small but significant rule of thumb driving in snow no matter what vehicle or tires you have= Drive slow. EVs torque makes it act like a grip in the icy snow I learned that driving 2013 Leaf. My RWD model 3 is 15 months young and it has more winter driving features than Leaf like Chill Mode, Low regen etc-I did not bother to switch to winter tires last winter-it drives like a champ.
Yep, slow and smooth. I have a seat setting that I call "Snow Day", that sets my seat a little higher/straighter, for better alertness, with chill mode and low regen. My seat is actually a little further back too, since I'm gonna be wearing my winter boots on a snow day.
 
  • Like
Reactions: SammichLover
Yep, slow and smooth. I have a seat setting that I call "Snow Day", that sets my seat a little higher/straighter, for better alertness, with chill mode and low regen. My seat is actually a little further back too, since I'm gonna be wearing my winter boots on a snow day.

Oh dang, a profile for chill+low regen is a great idea. That will help me avoid the temptation to set regen back to standard hopefully.
 
AWD helps you go forward faster, and in bad conditions may assist with un-stucking oneself at low speeds or even very low speed turning. However stopping, turning, and highway-speed maneuvers do not benefit from AWD in any way. The only way you can help this is to increase your friction with the road surface by getting tires that are better for it.
Exactly. Every owner of an AWD vehicle (regardless of make and model) needs to read that statement. Twice.
 
How many low salt areas were there around back then?

How many tons did that town car weigh?

Were your tires low rolling resistance tires?

Yeah, we’re all idiots.

Poke fun or laugh if you want but I actually worked at Auto dealerships up there. Service manager at Highway Ford Lincoln Mercury and parts and service manager at Hinkley Chevrolet Pontiac Buick which was also a Tire One distributor. surprisingly we sold no winter tires in Minnesota we didn't even stock them we would only order them if it was a special request it really is not an issue the need for winter tires was pretty non-existent.

Now to give you some more information my Lincoln Town cars weight was comprable to a current Model 3 due to the roughly thousand-pound battery pack contained therein. The weights are not that dissimilar overall. They are both just a tad over 4,000 lb. Look it up.

Low-salt? I lived in faribault county in South Central Minnesota extremely rural, my town was population 350 ish. Low-salt? LOL.

Tires? Michelin X Green all season radial.

My apologies for naming names in my reply I generally don't do that but I'm not blowing smoke I actually have the experience first hand and I can tell you that you will probably be okay with a good all season Tire on an all wheel drive 4000 pound car unless you just don't know how to drive.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: SammichLover
Exactly. Every owner of an AWD vehicle (regardless of make and model) needs to read that statement. Twice.
....and then realize only the "stopping" part is true (and not even that exactly in the case of a vehicle with regen braking, depending on the situation and how fancy your T/C S/C is). Anyone that claims that AWD doesn't aid with turning and maneuvering isn't giving you the straight story.

Now whether or not the extra benefit of the AWD is enough for a given situation when you have sub-standard tires, that is certainly in question. But that statement you quoted is misleading in that AWD in fact does increase your working traction, increases the friction you can utilize for directing the vehicle where you want it to go.
 
Last edited:
So I have a job in medicine which means I have to work no matter what the weather. After going through this thread it looks like winter tires would be helpful for my M3 performance . Looking at tirerack.com it looks like I can get
PIRELLI
WINTER SOTTOZERO 3
for 1800 total or the

MICHELIN
PILOT ALPIN PA4 N-SPEC
for 1300 which both would be worth it considering i have to drive no matter what. Question for the group is . has anyone had experience with Tirerack install in the DC area.There's a mobile installer called ASAP mobile installer. Did they know about the unique tesla jack points or did you have issues ? Do installers move over the TPMS sensors or do you have to get new ones? Also any deals on wheels which would make it just easier each season?

Thanks
 
  • Like
Reactions: SammichLover
Get a Second set of wheels.

Tirerack TPMS work perfect. They are made by Continental and are 433hz.

You can get a set rims from TSportline or Tirerack. You could get a smaller rim from 3rd party that fits Performance brakes.

Tesla offers a full package As does TSportline.
 
So I have a job in medicine which means I have to work no matter what the weather. After going through this thread it looks like winter tires would be helpful for my M3 performance . Looking at tirerack.com it looks like I can get
PIRELLI
WINTER SOTTOZERO 3
for 1800 total or the

MICHELIN
PILOT ALPIN PA4 N-SPEC
for 1300 which both would be worth it considering i have to drive no matter what. Question for the group is . has anyone had experience with Tirerack install in the DC area.There's a mobile installer called ASAP mobile installer. Did they know about the unique tesla jack points or did you have issues ? Do installers move over the TPMS sensors or do you have to get new ones? Also any deals on wheels which would make it just easier each season?

Thanks
For $1800, you can get a full set of 18" wheels and winter tires for your car. There are a LOT of advantages to this approach.
 
....and then realize only the "stopping" part is true (and not even that exactly in the case of a vehicle with regen braking, depending on the situation and how fancy your T/C S/C is). Anyone that claims that AWD doesn't aid with turning and maneuvering isn't giving you the straight story.

Now whether or not the extra benefit of the AWD is enough for a given situation when you have sub-standard tires, that is certainly in question. But that statement you quoted is misleading in that AWD in fact does increase your working traction, increases the friction you can utilize for directing the vehicle where you want it to go.

Given a road surface (pick compact snow, for example), and a specific tire, there is a number for static friction. You can count this as a fixed number for the surface to tire interaction, as this number only depends on how the materials interact. The only way to increase this number is changing the road surface, or changing the tire.

Regen braking at all four wheels is potentially nice, but dangerous (Tesla rightly recommends switching to low regen in snowy conditions) and cannot increase friction. Your braking system utilizes all four wheels for stopping as well, and is suitable for the task. In both of these cases, it is indeed "braking" which if there is too much of will overcome the static friction, meaning sliding on the surface instead of gripping it.

At low speeds, I did mention AWD helps even for turning, of course.
As for turning benefits above low speeds, AWD only helps if you are accelerating AND if your vehicle employs active torque vectoring (Model 3 cannot do this as it can't control the right vs. left power without using brakes). Many AWD vehicles disable either the front or rear drives at highway speeds anyways, and some suspect the Model 3 disables the front as well (I haven't seen anything conclusive on this). Turning while coasting or maintaining steady speeds simply has no benefit because the AWD is not sufficiently driving any wheels. In fact, acceleration while turning increases the risk of breaking the static friction (starting to slide) because you're applying more force (the other forces are those bringing the car through the turn, which increase with speed through the turn). With FWD this means you lose steering. With RWD, you fishtail. With AWD, you flip a coin to see which end broke loose if not both!

Rally drivers indeed benefit from full time AWD with more complicated differentials, much of the benefit coming from acceleration. Cornering is helped too, but cornering rally-style on public roads might get some sirens coming your way (terribly fun though, isn't it?).
 
  • Like
Reactions: holmgang
Given a road surface (pick compact snow, for example), and a specific tire, there is a number for static friction. You can count this as a fixed number for the surface to tire interaction, as this number only depends on how the materials interact. The only way to increase this number is changing the road surface, or changing the tire.

Regen braking at all four wheels is potentially nice, but dangerous (Tesla rightly recommends switching to low regen in snowy conditions) and cannot increase friction. Your braking system utilizes all four wheels for stopping as well, and is suitable for the task. In both of these cases, it is indeed "braking" which if there is too much of will overcome the static friction, meaning sliding on the surface instead of gripping it.

When you use all 4 wheels, particularly including the front rather than just the rear, you get clearly get better braking out of the tires.

Yes you should use Low, but that doesn’t change the above.

Rally drivers indeed benefit from full time AWD with more complicated differentials, much of the benefit coming from acceleration. Cornering is helped too, but cornering rally-style on public roads might get some sirens coming your way (terribly fun though, isn't it?).

So “Yeah, AWD does provide more turning in and of itself”.

Even outside “low speed”. Anyone that says “AWD doesn’t help you turn” is full of nonsense.

So is anyone that tries to pretend that there is some magical difference between “rally driving” and “driving on the street when something unexpected comes up and it is a tense moment putting demand on car & driver”. The only difference is how often and how far you lean into having such moments come up.
 
Last edited: