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Cadillac ELR (Converj)
- Thread starter Takumi
- Start date
I've seen 1% of all sold ELRs. I just saw the 3rd drive by as I was heading off for work this morning.
Blastphemy
Member
It's to be expected because there hasn't been any meaningful advertising; the Olympics "the rest of the world sucks" advertising bombed; GM executives have stated they believe environmentally-conscious consumers don't buy luxury cars (and so they're not targeting Volt owners who downgraded from luxury cars); GM doesn't seem to know how to convey the vast improvements found in the ELR in any meaningful way, so Cadillac only talks about the interior wood and leather instead of the $20,000 of new technology put in the car; and the acceleration is fractionally worse than the Volt.
The ELR is indeed a $76k car, but the way Cadillac treats it it's a future $60k car just waiting for its fire sale. Well, they'll get that pretty soon if each month results in fewer sales than the previous one!
Cadillac produced its entire run of ELRs for the year at once rather then building to the actual demand. Remember that these cars were all ordered by dealerships, not just arbitrarily built by Cadillac. But the dealerships can't sell the ELR since there's no meaningful support for the vehicle from GM aside from some amazing lease rates.
Cadillac seriously miscalculated what people would be comparing the ELR to. GM probably thought BMW, Lexus, and Mercedes owners who wanted an electric hybrid plug-in would flock to it, and that all comparisons to Tesla would be based on how much more luxury and high-end materials were in the ELR. But if any Cadillac executive had spent even five minutes on any ELR message board, they would have seen that acceleration was going to be the sole benchmark of comparison when talking Tesla, if not also BMW, Lexus, and Mercedes.
I got to drive the ELR for a short stint on city streets. Interior was very nice. Drove nicely also, same as the Volt. The engine seemed noticeably quieter than the Volt. A great luxury coupe (2+2), but not a GT like a 500 SL, XLR, etc.
I drove a Spark EV afterwards. The Spark interior was quite a letdown after the ELR, much more low-rent than the mid-priced hatchbacks that I am used to. However, the Spark was fun to drive in the city.
GSP
I drove a Spark EV afterwards. The Spark interior was quite a letdown after the ELR, much more low-rent than the mid-priced hatchbacks that I am used to. However, the Spark was fun to drive in the city.
GSP
I'm glad you said $20,000 of new technology. What's $35,000 (price of a volt) plus $20,000? It's a $50k-$55k car (before tax credits) tops.
PS, Tesla hasn't done any meaningful advertising either.
Blastphemy
Member
That $20k is just for the hardware. There's also a price to be paid for design, interior materials, and exclusivity which is how Cadillac gets to $76k. If Cadillac had invested some money and effort into improving the acceleration, they could have charged even more. (There's rumors of an ELR-V, but sincerely doubt it.)
Tesla doesn't need to advertise because all of its cars are pre-sold due to its brilliant advanced sales model, word-of-mouth, and viral marketing. Not to mention opening many stores in highly-trafficed malls that bring brand recognition and show off how cool the Model S is. Nobody walks into a Cadillac dealership unless they're in the market for a car. But millions walk by Tesla stores just in the normal course of shopping.
As far as I'm concerned, the Olympics ad did its job: it piqued my interest and got me to investigate the car. The ad may have been offensive, but I don't think that has a major effect on selling cars. Getting people to think about the car is more important, and the ad did that.
For me, performance is important. It's true that I didn't drive the car. There are a lot of cars I didn't drive. I drove two cars that were noticeably cheaper than the car I bought: the Hyundai Genesis, and the Infiniti M45. With both cars, I told the sales rep I was done with the test drive about 10 seconds into the test drive. Would I have been happier with the performance of the ELR? I doubt it.
Anyway, I don't think the ELR's problem is a lack of advertising; it's a lack of performance. You might not feel that an expensive car needs a better 0-60 time, but many (most?) buyers do.
I think it's odd that only one company so far seems to have realized that if you use a lot of batteries, you solve two problems: you get more power and you get more range. yeah, you gotta pay more for the big battery, but a high power high range expensive vehicle is much more competitive than a low power low range cheap vehicle. or in the ELR's case, a low power low electric range expensive vehicle.
The term "exclusive" is typically reserved for something not many people can have, rather than something not many people want.
rolosrevenge
Dr. EVS
Blastphemy
Member
If you've read any of my prior posts, you'd see that I have said exactly the opposite. Had the ELR been engineered with a 0-60 time at least equal to the 60kWh Model S, Cadillac could have charged even more for it. I have stated many times previously that Cadillac should be embarrassed that the ELR is the slowest-to-60mph $76k+ vehicle on the market.
The definition of "exclusive" is 'unique,' 'limited,' 'belonging to a particular individual or group,' 'fashionable or stylish,' and 'incompatible.' That word does not directly refer to the mass desirability of a product, although I admit people many don't appear to understand that.
Regardless, to your point, just because a product has limited appeal does not make it less desirable. There are only so many people in the U.S. who inclusively (i) want a 2+2 coupe, (ii) don't want a hatchback, (iii) want a plug-in hybrid electric vehicle, (iv) want a GM vehicle, (v) can afford a $76-84k vehicle, and (vi) are currently looking for a new car. Low sales for the ELR simply means Cadillac has a very small market for the car, not that it isn't exclusive or desirable.
Idiotic statements by GM and very poor marketing sure doesn't help sales, but there probably aren't very many people out there who pay attention to what Mark Reuss and Uwe Ellinghaus blabber on about (or even know who they are). But I completely agree with you and derekt75 that a 0-60 time comparable to the Model S would have made a significant difference in sales, especially to wealthy Volt drivers who are ready to trade up to (or get back into) a luxury car.
Of course, had the ELR come first and Volt second, no one would be having this conversation. Another bad decision by GM, unfortunately...
If GM had made the ELR have the acceleration of the base Model S then maybe it might be worth what they charge now. You really think by dropping the acceleration to slightly less than 6 seconds they could raise the price?
You are right that the Volt shouldn't have gone first. They forced this value comparison on themselves.
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Sorry, I have read your prior posts, and I should have phrased my point better. I meant that while you personally are willing to pay luxury car prices for a car with non-luxury 0-60, you're more of an exception than the rule. I think we all know this.
What I wanted to say is that I think that GM actually did do a reasonable job advertising. They advertised their car heavily during the Olympics with a message of "this is a luxury car". Was the ad offensive? a bit. Did it get folks to look into the ELR? I suspect it did. What else could you have realistically hoped for?
There's no point in advertising that the car is environmentally friendly. All the environmentalists already feel that plug-ins are environmentally friendly so there's no point in that. GM needed to get across the idea that the ELR was a luxury car. I thought they did that.
I don't think this is an outbound marketing problem at all.
I think the only problem is the price/performance ratio.
Tesla has been quite successful selling the only $80k 4-door that doesn't have adaptive cruise control, collision avoidance, and several other features that they "should be embarrassed" to not have.
I wonder if GM figured that if there was a significant population willing to buy a luxury car lacking in awareness of its surroundings, there would also be a significant population willing to buy a car that had that but was missing the performance.
I guess now we know that there isn't.
or maybe there is that population, but they just don't want a sport-styled 2-door.
However, that engineering was simply not going to happen with this run, because performance cars need ground-up engineering that's hard and expensive.
GM doesn't need to be embarrassed at the performance, it needs to be embarrassed at the price it asked.
The Lexus CT200h sells 1k+ per month It's a tweaked Prius.
The MKZ Hybrid, a tweaked Fusion, sells 600 to 700 per month.
There are for more than 50 sales per month out there for non-performance luxury at incremental pricing above mainstream. It doesn't matter whether the drip-drip-drip of sales at higher price is better than selling for less, it's been a PR and marketing disaster. At $55k they'd have had way more interest, as the great disappointment at gm-volt.com indicates. If they couldn't get good margin with 18-months of sales from turning the Volt into a luxury car for an extra $15k, they'd have been better off either not doing it or selling at the same margin as the Volt just to get PEV into the Cadillac consciousness, and then taking a fresh approach with Gen 2.
mknox
Well-Known Member
This seems to be the only real issue with the car. Just about everything I've read has been generally positive except when it comes to the price. I wonder if GM simply thought they could make up for some of the Voltec development costs on the backs of (presumably) more affluent Cadillac buyers?
Kipernicus
Model S Res#P1440
My first ELR sighting, although not a customer car. Foster City Costco price $67,825. (It included adaptive cruise control and luxury packages).
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