Car & Driver: The Mach E is simply better than the Model Y

[Unobtanium]

Here, I corrected your list:

Call
Order
Get agreed trade value (no negotiation involved, more like Carmax etc.)
Wait (edit: and prepare payment)
Pick up the car and ink the deal
Drive off and enjoy.

Edit2: a Honda I got several years ago took me hours of "calls", hours of "inking the deal", multiple trips to the dealership, and my wife remembering me that for the past 9 years. I'm so glad that Tesla is so much easier to deal with. I only wish Tesla could sell in my state.

Thats nuts man. I just call, set up the deal, and arrive. Ive never negotiated for more than about 5 minutes, and usually not even that.They have always had the car ready for me. Paperwork is either emailed and all e sign or a short few minutes in finance to agree on maintenanceor warranty packages, if any. I cannot fathom that nonsense you described.

My Acura experience was nothing like your Honda experience. Ive not owned Homda though, so maybe Honda sucks. I know Volvo was the only one Ive iwned that was an annoying purchase experiences, but everyone hates dealing with Volvo.

 

[alexgr]

Thats nuts man. I just call, set up the deal, and arrive. Ive never negotiated for more than about 5 minutes, and usually not even that.They have always had the car ready for me. Paperwork is either emailed and all e sign or a short few minutes in finance to agree on maintenanceor warranty packages, if any. I cannot fathom that nonsense you described.

My Acura experience was nothing like your Honda experience. Ive not owned Homda though, so maybe Honda sucks. I know Volvo was the only one Ive iwned that was an annoying purchase experiences, but everyone hates dealing with Volvo.

You are really a lucky one, especially considering you was buying at Kia.
I remember the b.s. that a local Hyundai dealership treated me to when I considered their Sonata Hybrid long time ago, and the Ionic 5 last year. For the Ionic, they just wanted $5800 over MSRP of ~$50k, making it the same price as MY before options.

 

[alexgr]

My Acura experience was nothing like your Honda experience. Ive not owned Homda though, so maybe Honda sucks. I know Volvo was the only one Ive iwned that was an annoying purchase experiences, but everyone hates dealing with Volvo.

Acura was somewhat better, but it took me 2 days to negotiate a KBB median price in 2012. Honda varies a lot from dealership to dealership. I was buying an Accord Hybrid in 2014, and the only one (in EX-L trim) was 100 miles from me in the time. The last Accord was in February, Sport trim, nothing fancy. We were buying it for our Ukrainian refugee family member, and when I mentioned that, they told me they will not sell it to me because it is somehow a fraud according to them. So I sent in my wife, and she spent 6 f*cking hours there, they first told her the price higher than they told me ($32k instead of $30k), and I now think they really try to upsale women a lot. They tried to add extra $hit, maintenance plan, etc. etc. etc.

 

[Unobtanium]

Acura was somewhat better, but it took me 2 days to negotiate a KBB median price in 2012. Honda varies a lot from dealership to dealership. I was buying an Accord Hybrid in 2014, and the only one (in EX-L trim) was 100 miles from me in the time. The last Accord was in February, Sport trim, nothing fancy. We were buying it for our Ukrainian refugee family member, and when I mentioned that, they told me they will not sell it to me because it is somehow a fraud according to them. So I sent in my wife, and she spent 6 f*cking hours there, they first told her the price higher than they told me ($32k instead of $30k), and I now think they really try to upsale women a lot. They tried to add extra $hit, maintenance plan, etc. etc. etc.

Wild. I took 30 seconds to negotiate. One of my quicker ones. Got $3k over sticker for tradein at the Acura dealer. Another 2 minutes and the $1999 package turned into $999 for ASPEC matts and an interior warranty and the rest at msrp for their car. Ive just never really had issues with negotiation. If Tesla won't negotiate, though, that is a huge red flag, given that their trade offers are inferior even at the top of the offered range.

 

[Unobtanium]

You are really a lucky one, especially considering you was buying at Kia.
I remember the b.s. that a local Hyundai dealership treated me to when I considered their Sonata Hybrid long time ago, and the Ionic 5 last year. For the Ionic, they just wanted $5800 over MSRP of ~$50k, making it the same price as MY before options.

Oh, yah. My Kia sales rep is now my concierge. Message him and he'll coordinate service appt for me, etc. Kia dealership was very nice. Finance a breeze. Car ready and waiting when I arrived. Nothing but love for em! Negotiations were kinda oof, but that was because the market tanked then. They gave me fair market though, and sold me my GT ar msrp. Even had my new PSAS4s on it when I arrived, no charge for mount and balance.

This last week, I took it in for service and they offered to deliver it back home to me when they done everything. Thats 250mi drive! Put me in an ev6 wind with tech that had 20mi on it, as a loaner. (They kept my GT to verify a concern I had with tech line who was backed up that day, after MemorialDay.)

Can't beat that, imo. Volvo was similar, there.

 

[kpanda17]

this story is a total outlier (statistically outside the norm) as the public likes direct sales without dealers, that is the trend the legacy auto is bending toward that
glad you had a great experience, the rest of us hate legacy auto dealers

 

[Unobtanium]

this story is a total outlier (statistically outside the norm) as the public likes direct sales without dealers, that is the trend the legacy auto is bending toward that
glad you had a great experience, the rest of us hate legacy auto dealers

I mainly like legacy dealers because they have a service dept.

 

[alexgr]

Wild. I took 30 seconds to negotiate. One of my quicker ones. Got $3k over sticker for tradein at the Acura dealer. Another 2 minutes and the $1999 package turned into $999 for ASPEC matts and an interior warranty and the rest at msrp for their car. Ive just never really had issues with negotiation. If Tesla won't negotiate, though, that is a huge red flag, given that their trade offers are inferior even at the top of the offered range.

I never understand the idea of doing a trade in other than if the tax reduction is worth it. But anyway, I always shop around for the best offer: private sale, Carmax, and then the best last deal for my old Acura was at a Honda dealership, $2-3k over everyone else, even over Carmax. A general advice is to sell your car independent of you deal buying the car. Many many places don't negotiate when they are buying your car.

Also, every penny the dealership gets is taken from you and not going back to the manufacturer for potential engineering research.

 

[alexgr]

Oh, yah. My Kia sales rep is now my concierge. Message him and he'll coordinate service appt for me, etc. Kia dealership was very nice.

This is VERY unusual as all major dealerships I know have different sales and service departments.

 

[alexgr]

I mainly like legacy dealers because they have a service dept.

I like Tesla because it has service dept without sales.

 

[Unobtanium]

I like Tesla because it has service dept without sales.

Yeah, there is a dealer near me thats an authorized repair center. They seem very squared away.

 

[Unobtanium]

This is VERY unusual as all major dealerships I know have different sales and service departments.

Yes...but they are in the same building and have phones and see each other and stuff. It gets handled.

 

[Unobtanium]

I never understand the idea of doing a trade in other than if the tax reduction is worth it. But anyway, I always shop around for the best offer: private sale, Carmax, and then the best last deal for my old Acura was at a Honda dealership, $2-3k over everyone else, even over Carmax. A general advice is to sell your car independent of you deal buying the car. Many many places don't negotiate when they are buying your car.

Also, every penny the dealership gets is taken from you and not going back to the manufacturer for potential engineering research.

Ive always done fine on trade in, and its worth 3-4k in taxes typically.

 

[Sixth]

Hilarious, two threads that I was subbed to last year get bumped at the same time. New astroturfing account?

 

[drtimhill]

I think that interest rates play a big role,also.

Which would impact all EVs, including Tesla.

 

[chinney]

With dealer markups and mandatory add-ons, the price of a Mach E is significantly higher than for a Model Y. Meanwhile, the Model Y is significantly more advanced in its electric drivetrain technology. So buyers are making the logical choice.

Just to give you an example, I can buy a Model Y LR for $69,990 (Canadian dollars). And with Tesla I know that I can get it at that price. Meanwhile, my local Ford dealership has one model of the Mach-E available, the AWD Premium Edition, advertised at the ‘dealership’ price of $85,438. Based on my reading of the dealership website, that price is after the dealership markup, but you would still be unlikely to get it for that amount because (based on my past experience) there generally are additional charges for ‘options’ that are actually mandatory, as well as further hidden dealership fees. So the final price to the buyer of the Mach-E is higher - much higher. And even with those inflated prices, Ford is apparently losing money on the Mach-E. Further, while the Premium Edition is a pretty good vehicle on some fronts, the electric drive technology just can’t compare with the Model Y. The Mach-E is not a winner for Ford or its customers. That situation is just not sustainable for Ford.

 

[Unobtanium]

Just to give you an example, I can buy a Model Y LR for $69,990 (Canadian dollars). And with Tesla I know that I can get it at that price. Meanwhile, my local Ford dealership has one model of the Mach-E available, the AWD Premium Edition, advertised at the ‘dealership’ price of $85,438. Based on my reading of the dealership website, that price is after the dealership markup, but you would still be unlikely to get it for that amount because (based on my past experience) there generally are additional charges for ‘options’ that are actually mandatory, as well as further hidden dealership fees. So the final price to the buyer of the Mach-E is higher - much higher. And even with those inflated prices, Ford is apparently losing money on the Mach-E. Further, while the Premium Edition is a pretty good vehicle on some fronts, the electric drive technology just can’t compare with the Model Y. The Mach-E is not a winner for Ford or its customers. That situation is just not sustainable for Ford.

Ford really needs to step up and fix its battery issue and move on to 800v architecture, as well. If they could do that, the Mach E would be a winner. As it is, their new EV has very dated infrastructure.

 

[voxel]

Mach E is similarly priced now I believe.

Nope.

Premium AWD ER is about $62K which is the same as Model Y LR at $49K... and the Mach-E is only eligible for $3750 tax credit.

Also there's rarely EV markups in the US anymore... too much supply here. In Canada... it's a different problem.

Folks are very price sensitive which is why Toyotas are the top selling cars in the world. I forced my brother to test drive a bunch of EVs while I was visiting him in Austin and he liked the Ioniq 5 best but would buy a Tesla because it's "$10K" cheaper even though it was obviously the lesser car (he didn't care). He's a Sienna and multiple (former) Camry owner. It's no surprise that Toyota owners have flocked to Teslas because it's all about bargain and not quality lol.

 

[Unobtanium]

Nope.

Premium AWD ER is about $62K which is the same as Model Y LR at $49K... and the Mach-E is only eligible for $3750 tax credit.

Also there's rarely EV markups in the US anymore... too much supply here. In Canada... it's a different problem.

Folks are very price sensitive which is why Toyotas are the top selling cars in the world. I forced my brother to test drive a bunch of EVs while I was visiting him in Austin and he liked the Ioniq 5 best but would buy a Tesla because it's "$10K" cheaper even though it was obviously the lesser car (he didn't care). He's a Sienna and multiple (former) Camry owner. It's no surprise that Toyota owners have flocked to Teslas because it's all about bargain and not quality lol.

Toyota has a reputation that they're riding, and that reputation holds strong, as does their resale value, so there is still merit to Toyota.

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

Thats nuts man. I just call, set up the deal, and arrive. Ive never negotiated for more than about 5 minutes, and usually not even that.They have always had the car ready for me. Paperwork is either emailed and all e sign or a short few minutes in finance to agree on maintenance or warranty packages, if any. I cannot fathom that nonsense you described.

And there's part of the problem. You already know what you want, you've agreed the price and you _know_ they'll still keep trying to sell you stuff.

It also seems to take longer than it should. I just want to "sign then drive."