EAP HW2 - my experience thus far... [DJ Harry]

[Bladerskb]

I was under the impression that with the addition of the side cameras, EAP would render cars to your side and behind you to mitigate the present blind spot detection deficiencies. Doesn't appear that is the case at this time...
BTW, yesterday, there was a motorcycle rider in front of me weaving around so I kept waiting for my car to disengage from him and lock onto the next vehicle in front but it stayed on the motorcycle which was impressive.

I hate to break it to you guys again but the only camera active and used in the AP2 currently is only the main forward camera. This is why the car still has trouble with lanes or can't see stopped cars.

Tesla is only going to use the forward main camera to replicate the entire AP1 system as they were.

The two rearview looking will only be used for changing lanes when AP2 has reached feature completeness with ap1.

You would think the rear camera will aid in driving and making sure u are in the right lane and for detecting side barriers. But no. It will only be used for changing lanes. Sorta like how the sonar sensors are used.

Yes that makes EAP basically AP1 with more fancy features. Still stuck in LV2. The only camera that will be used to replicate AP1 features is the main forward camera. That's it.

This is why it's just as dangerous.

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

I just emailed Tesla, I think the subscribers in this thread would find it useful if you didn't happen to follow my firmware posts on the X sub forum.

Dear Tesla,

I wanted to provide additional feedback on firmware 2.50.185 after
driving this afternoon and evening.

TACC near collision with Prius Driver:

I was driving 50MPH down a city road with TACC enabled. A Prius driver
made a left turn on a red light against my green light driving
straight.

TACC made no attempt to slow down nor was FCW sensor triggered. I was
able to brake manually and prevent the collision. If I let TACC run,
the point of impact would have been the driver side door of the Prius.

Autosteer Confusion

For part of my trip, highway traffic slowed down enough to enable
autosteer. The road was the carpool lane on Interstate-5 between
Irvine and Anaheim. The lane had a white line on the left, a yellow
line on the right and a black line in the middle. Autosteer picked up
the black line and the yellow line to drive between. There was not
enough width between the black line and yellow line to constitute a
lane large enough for the Model X.

FCW False Positive

I had another FCW false positive with TACC enabled. I was going 50MPH
down a road that has a dip. Coming down the dip/out of the dip I
received a FCW warning, a red phantom car on my dashboard and the
Model X began to slow down.

I hope this feedback helps. Please feel free to contact me if I can be
of additional assistance.

Why do you keep using TACC in a manner that it is NOT meant for? It's the same kind of adaptive cruise control that's in your Volt. Do you use the adaptive cruise control system in the Volt in this manner?

 

[MXWing]

Why do you keep using TACC in a manner that it is NOT meant for? It's the same kind of adaptive cruise control that's in your Volt. Do you use the adaptive cruise control system in the Volt in this manner?

I keep using TACC in this manner because I am wanting to simulate all possible scenarios to make a better product and to potentially save a life.

Besides when you say do not use in this manner, what other manner would we be using it if we expect FSDC one day? FSDC works in all cases except for when a car runs a red light in front of you?

I do not trust the firmware for ACC on my Volt. I will never be able to trust ACC on this generation of Volt since Chevrolet has no way to update it like how Tesla can. Consider I lease my Premier Volt at $300 per month, you bet my expectations for Tesla will be far higher.

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

Blind spot detection is NOT an AP1 feature so I am puzzled by your puzzlement

What I think is rather odd is the absence of information on how well the blindspot monitoring works with an AP2 car. Even if they don't have it tied in yet to the side cameras there is still the possibility that it works better than an AP1 car. That is because the ultrasonic sensors used are of an improved version.

Regardless of how Tesla categorizes blindspot monitoring I would put it under the AP Hardware package under the active safety category along with collision avoidance, and automatic emergency braking. You get those standard with the car even if you don't get the eAP package. None of those things have reached parity with an AP1 car.

I do expect an AP2 car at some point to use the cameras along with DNN object detection to show what's next to you like you described.

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

I keep using TACC in this manner because I am wanting to simulate all possible scenarios to make a better product and to potentially save a life.

Besides when you say do not use in this manner, what other manner would we be using it if we expect FSDC one day? FSDC works in all cases except for when a car runs a red light in front of you?

I do not trust the firmware for ACC on my Volt. I will never be able to trust ACC on this particular Volt since Chevrolet has no way to update it like how Tesla can. Consider I lease my Premier Volt at $300 per month, you bet my expectations for Tesla will be far higher.

But, you're simulating things it's NOT meant for. It's not anything more than a ACC system. It's why it was the first to be released because it's not tied into any heavy lifting the AP computer has to do.

Once they do release a more full fledged AP you'll be able to do the kind of testing you want. Especially once AEB is added (which is active all the time).

If you really want to do some testing you can always see just how dirty the windshield can get before AP performance seriously degrades. You can also see if the FCW can pick up pedestrians. That could potentially be implemented.

 

[MXWing]

But, you're simulating things it's NOT meant for. It's not anything more than a ACC system. It's why it was the first to be released because it's not tied into any heavy lifting the AP computer has to do.

Once they do release a more full fledged AP you'll be able to do the kind of testing you want. Especially once AEB is added (which is active all the time).

If you really want to do some testing you can always see just how dirty the windshield can get before AP performance seriously degrades. You can also see if the FCW can pick up pedestrians. That could potentially be implemented.

Tesla contacted me just now requesting specific times for the events. They are are interested investigating it further.

Per some of the replies I've seen, the data I'm discovering is also "new" to them. If the Model 3 were to hypothetically ship with the same firmware that I have, we can count on multiple accidents day 1 if people were making assumptions on what works and what doesn't work.

Remember, not everyone is up to speed as you are on what all the limitations are.

 

[seevT]

I anyone on 2.50.185 seeing "system Powering Up" message when you enter the car after it has been parked for sometime (saw it 3 times since today afternoon)

i cross posted on the other thread as well but wanted to poll here aswell.

Systems are powering up

 

[Saghost]

I anyone on 2.50.185 seeing "system Powering Up" message when you enter the car after it has been parked for sometime (saw it 3 times since today afternoon)

i cross posted on the other thread as well but wanted to poll here aswell.

Systems are powering up

I don't have that firmware, but that's something you'll routinely see if you've been away from the car for a while and have the power saving sleep modes enabled and haven't woken the car with a phone command or something. It's normal, and nothing to worry about unless it doesn't clear in ~10 seconds.

 

[seevT]

Autosteer been working pretty well for me. I have tried it ~20 times so far and in stop and go traffic it is awesome. Here is a video i took (i know i took some risk by taking my hand off to take the video

Update on Auto Steer

So this evening auto steer finally lite up in the beautiful 405 traffic.
First impression - not very smooth. My paranoia went from 7 to a full 10

• The lane markers on the instrument panel keeps "dancing" (sways left and right) - not sure if others notice this too. This happens all the time and more noticeable when the vehicle is stopped. Probably something to do with the depth of vision tri cameras.
• At one point I had to take over as it started drifting to close to a car on right ( may be not, but I felt it was too close to the other car that was drifting to the left and I did NOT know if EAP was tracking. There is no visual indication ). A hard steer would take over Auto Steer but still leaves TACC engaged. Maybe folks knew this but it wasn't obvious to me - but that makes sense. Also means you have to decide to hit the brakes or force the wheel. A new thing to learn.
• Lastly my Tesla service technician mentioned that there is one known issue with auto steer. if you are driving close to the triple marked carpool lane (Two yellow on the outside and one white line on the inside) apparently the car has an affinity to follow the white line thus drifting closer into the carpool lane) I did not experience it but he warned me about it.

So some ways to go...

 

[seevT]

I don't have that firmware, but that's something you'll routinely see if you've been away from the car for a while and have the power saving sleep modes enabled and haven't woken the car with a phone command or something. It's normal, and nothing to worry about unless it doesn't clear in ~10 seconds.

thanks. My usage behavior has been the same since i got the car so wondering why this started now..

 

[Saghost]

thanks. My usage behavior has been the same since i got the car so wondering why this started now..

Well, something changed. Either something was keeping the car awake before, or the firmware you had before wasn't letting the car sleep properly for some reason.

 

[hariclt]

Autosteer been working pretty well for me. I have tried it ~20 times so far and in stop and go traffic it is awesome. Here is a video i took (i know i took some risk by taking my hand off to take the video

Thanks for the video ... please keep the feedback coming! We are all living vicariously through your shoes!

 

[ZeroDarkSilver]

Autosteer been working pretty well for me. I have tried it ~20 times so far and in stop and go traffic it is awesome. Here is a video i took (i know i took some risk by taking my hand off to take the video

Thanks for the vid. Looks like it confirms that either AP2 is not currently tracking cars in adjacent lanes, or at the very least it is not rendering them on the display. Feels like long way to go.

 

[croman]

Hopefully Tesla has confidence now to release this to all owners.

 

[DJ 240V]

@seevT thanks for the video . Your autosteer does appear smooth. Way different from my experience .

when I was driving today in slow moving traffic on 405 , a car on the right slightly drifted towards our lane but still stayed in his lane ( still safely far). If I was driving it would not have alarmed me, but the auto steer made a wild and quick left and right appearing to avoid it . Surprised me quite a bit. On top of that when on a straight path it makes these constant continuous adjustment - which I don't see in your video . Have you experienced that ?

Based on my experience I would say it's not ready for prime time. ( Auto Steer specifically )

 

[DJ 240V]

Autosteer been working pretty well for me. I have tried it ~20 times so far and in stop and go traffic it is awesome. Here is a video i took (i know i took some risk by taking my hand off to take the video

On a closer look , I see the blue highlighted lane markings ever so lightly moving left and right - when your hands are on the wheel do you feel the steering moving left and right ever so slightly ?

 

[seevT]

Hi DJ,i do see the blue lines move a bit (visually) but the steering is rock solid as far as i can rememer. Will keep your pointer when i am doing autosteer again.[[.i am literally chasing traffic so i can enable autosteer ]]

 

[cryptyk]

Autosteer been working pretty well for me. I have tried it ~20 times so far and in stop and go traffic it is awesome. Here is a video i took (i know i took some risk by taking my hand off to take the video

Heyyy, I work two exits East of where you took that video

 

[MarcusMaximus]

Heyyy, I work two exits East of where you took that video

I didn't want to mention it before but, because you did: I lived near there until we moved last Feb.

 

[Matias]

I hate to break it to you guys again but the only camera active and used in the AP2 currently is only the main forward camera. This is why the car still has trouble with lanes or can't see stopped cars.

Tesla is only going to use the forward main camera to replicate the entire AP1 system as they were.

The two rearview looking will only be used for changing lanes when AP2 has reached feature completeness with ap1.

You would think the rear camera will aid in driving and making sure u are in the right lane and for detecting side barriers. But no. It will only be used for changing lanes. Sorta like how the sonar sensors are used.

Yes that makes EAP basically AP1 with more fancy features. Still stuck in LV2. The only camera that will be used to replicate AP1 features is the main forward camera. That's it.

This is why it's just as dangerous.

How do you know which cameras are active in EAP?