Firmware 7.0 Beta Discussion

[Cyclone]

I don't think what you are referring to rises to a lie. I think we all understood that when Elon says something will be released to beta on a certain date, that date is obviously a moving target. You never know when issues pop up. I don't think it's appropriate to parse Tesla's statements in this manner, suggesting that they lied. I do not agree at all.

Plus, we have no visibility to their rollout schedule. There could be "levels" of the EAP and some got the first version and now some are getting the second version (of EAP Autopilot).

 

[twinpeaks]

That was a non-autopilot car.

Thanks, just got the same idea.

 

[Coiled]

The potential down side to this is that your hands may be busy with something else at the precise moment Autopilot releases control in the middle of a sharp curve due to unclear lane markers. And over a cliff you go...

Yes, that is the potential down side (literally). How and when the car notifies you, how it handles those situations until you take over, and how much it trusts you to be alert and ready to take over, those are all going to be very interesting to see. Just because I want my hands free doesn't mean I'm going to be holding a Big Mac in one and a drink in the other.

 

[Max*]

Yes, that is the potential down side (literally). How and when the car notifies you, how it handles those situations until you take over, and how much it trusts you to be alert and ready to take over, those are all going to be very interesting to see. Just because I want my hands free doesn't mean I'm going to be holding a Big Mac in one and a drink in the other.

Autopilot != Autonomous driving

The car is not SUPPOSED to handle anything until you take over, because you should be in control at all times. Now, hopefully Tesla does a better job with autosteer than it did with TACC when it can't work.

Just like TACC you let the car do it's job, but you watch it closely and have to be ready to intervene in case the car does something stupid.

 

[AmpedRealtor]

Yes, that is the potential down side (literally). How and when the car notifies you, how it handles those situations until you take over, and how much it trusts you to be alert and ready to take over, those are all going to be very interesting to see. Just because I want my hands free doesn't mean I'm going to be holding a Big Mac in one and a drink in the other.

You're a better man than I!

(putting down Big Mac)

 

[green1]

It will work now just like my 4Runner works (when it engages, 4Runner won't engage on flat road), plus have an indicator light. Personally, I anticipate liking this setup. Removing my foot from the brake (after a sufficient time for hill hold to engage) will give me whatever amount of time I need to hit the go-pedal. So I can let go when the light turns green, but have the car wait while the four cars in front of me take off.

I like that part, my worry is that if you hit the brake a second time for some reason, it disengages. This is kinda counter-intuitive, make sure you don't accidentally double-tap the brake as your applying it or you won't have hill hold even though you're expecting it.

 

[Ingineer]

I like that part, my worry is that if you hit the brake a second time for some reason, it disengages. This is kinda counter-intuitive, make sure you don't accidentally double-tap the brake as your applying it or you won't have hill hold even though you're expecting it.

The release notes imply that it will only enter hold mode with a firm press, so a slight press will release (if enabled) or just be normal braking w/o hold.

 

[Cyclone]

I like that part, my worry is that if you hit the brake a second time for some reason, it disengages. This is kinda counter-intuitive, make sure you don't accidentally double-tap the brake as your applying it or you won't have hill hold even though you're expecting it.

True, but then at the first inkling of roll, you press the brake and hold it, looking to see if that indicator is on. While it may catch off guard, it shouldn't be a problem seeing as you just used the brake to come to a stop, so you just recently were thinking of stopping.

 

[drsaab]

The release notes imply that it will only enter hold mode with a firm press, so a slight press will release (if enabled) or just be normal braking w/o hold.

This is how my Mercedes did it. Push hard after stopped and it goes to hold mode.

 

[Chasedrgc1223]

Autopilot is distinctively driver assistance, meaning the driver is responsible for any and all actions of the vehicle.

 

[Coiled]

The car is not SUPPOSED to handle anything until you take over, because you should be in control at all times.

That just looks like double-talk nonsense to me, unless you're saying that auto-steering should never actually be used. I am talking about the transition from (1) supervising the car's auto-steering to (2) taking manual control of the steering because the car doesn't know what to do. I think we can agree it's important that the car and the driver both handle that transition well.

If the lane markings disappear on a curve, how far in advance will the car notify you? And if you don't take the wheel instantly (start steering manually), will the car release the wheel anyway and let you go straight off the road, or will it follow its most recent path, or will it take its best guess at where the lane is even though confidence is low? It has to take some course of action, and they all have risks.

- - - Updated - - -

I've wrote an article on Electrek.co (which was later posted here too) about the first early released including how steering wheel alerts work and now with information being confirmed with the leaked release notes.

Not that I have any reason to doubt you, but the article sort of ambiguously described how lane-keeping "will" work or "did" work in some beta version that may or may not have been the first EAP release. The pictures don't really show it. The recently leaked release notes don't confirm that it was in the EAP cars before now either.

Are you confirming that you saw it yourself or heard directly from EAP participants that lane-keeping was in the mid-August release?

 

[FredLambert]

Are you confirming that you saw it yourself or heard directly from EAP participants that lane-keeping was in the mid-August release?

I will not talk about my sources, but there was plenty of information from my mid-august article now confirmed by the new release. For example:

Also, Model S owners now have access to more information, like individual tire pressure readings.

That was never confirmed by Tesla and now it is confirmed by the release notes. Whether you want to believe the rest of the article is up to you...

 

[apacheguy]

So let me get this right. The only way to display the ambient temp is to place a ginormous analog clock that takes up half of the IC screen real estate? I must be missing something.

 

[yobigd20]

Do you think the suggestion to hold the steering wheel is simply because it's a beta or are we going to always have to keep a hand on the wheel, S-Class stylie?

There was an owner who bumped into a Tesla tech out there on the west coast at a supercharger a few months ago and the car the tesla tech was testing had 7.0 and let the owner look at it and explained the hand holding requirement. The tech said he didn't like it either but tesla is forcing it upon people for liability reasons they want to make sure people are still paying attention since this is autopilot and not fully autonomous.

 

[Andyw2100]

There was an owner who bumped into a Tesla tech out there on the west coast at a supercharger and the car had 7.0 and let the owner look at it and explained the hand holding requirement. The tech said he didn't like it either but tesla is forcing it upon people for liability reasons they want to make sure people are still paying attention since this is autopilot and not fully autonomous.

Actually that was well before the beta release to the EAP. And the nag requirement the Tesla person talked about had only recently been added. The Tesla employee said that he (or she) was providing negative feedback on that, and hoping Tesla would do away with it.

 

[Todd Burch]

So let me get this right. The only way to display the ambient temp is to place a ginormous analog clock that takes up half of the IC screen real estate? I must be missing something.

Could still be on the 17", right? After all, currently the outside temperature is shown on both the console and the touchscreen. Seems a bit redundant if you ask me.

 

[Max*]

That just looks like double-talk nonsense to me, unless you're saying that auto-steering should never actually be used. I am talking about the transition from (1) supervising the car's auto-steering to (2) taking manual control of the steering because the car doesn't know what to do. I think we can agree it's important that the car and the driver both handle that transition well.

If the lane markings disappear on a curve, how far in advance will the car notify you? And if you don't take the wheel instantly (start steering manually), will the car release the wheel anyway and let you go straight off the road, or will it follow its most recent path, or will it take its best guess at where the lane is even though confidence is low? It has to take some course of action, and they all have risks.

I misunderstood your previous statement, the bolded clears up what you're talking about, sorry.

As to the rest of your comment, I already stated my opinion previously:

hopefully Tesla does a better job with autosteer than it did with TACC when it can't work.

I think I stated this in this thread: for me, the one time TACC disabled, there was no real warning (pretty much the second it disabled, there was a beep). Regen kicked on full blast. Thankfully we were paying attention and didn't get rearended. It would've been nicer to not have regen turn on, but to coast, but I can see the risk in that as well.

 

[Gizmotoy]

To deviate temporarily from the autopilot discussion...

There's a surprising amount of stuff in there for classics. That's pretty exciting.

What's not so exciting is that the already-lacking media app seems to be going backwards now. We lost the instrument panel media display, one of my favorite features! Hopefully there are changes that didn't make these leaked shots.

 

[Coiled]

Whether you want to believe the rest of the article is up to you...

You're right that stuff you said would be in v7 has been confirmed. It was a good reveal that I missed at the time. However, this is not a case of credibility because I don't think you explicitly said in the article that lane-keeping was in the mid-August EAP release. I guess you're confirming it now, which is great because it means they didn't just start testing it.

In my mind, that means there's a chance we'll actually see v7 rolled out to the public (Model S owners) around the 29th. Fingers crossed.

 

[yobigd20]

To deviate temporarily from the autopilot discussion...

There's a surprising amount of stuff in there for classics. That's pretty exciting.

What's not so exciting is that the already-lacking media app seems to be going backwards now. We lost the instrument panel media display, one of my favorite features! Hopefully there are changes that didn't make these leaked shots.

Explain? You mean they don't show music on the instruction panel anymore??