FSD Beta v11.x

The next big milestone for FSD is 11. It is a significant upgrade and fundamental changes to several parts of the FSD stack including totally new way to train the perception NN.

From AI day and Lex Fridman interview we have a good sense of what might be included.

- Object permanence both temporal and spatial
- Moving from “bag of points” to objects in NN
- Creating a 3D vector representation of the environment all in NN
- Planner optimization using NN / Monte Carlo Tree Search (MCTS)
- Change from processed images to “photon count” / raw image
- Change from single image perception to surround video
- Merging of city, highway and parking lot stacks a.k.a. Single Stack

Lex Fridman Interview of Elon. Starting with FSD related topics.

Here is a detailed explanation of Beta 11 in "layman's language" by James Douma, interview done after Lex Podcast.

Here is the AI Day explanation by in 4 parts.

Deep Understanding Tesla FSD Part 1: HydraNet

From Theory to Reality, Analyze the Evolution of Tesla Full Self-Driving

saneryee-studio.medium.com

Here is a useful blog post asking a few questions to Tesla about AI day. The useful part comes in comparison of Tesla's methods with Waymo and others (detailed papers linked).

Twelve Questions about Tesla Autopilot Technologies Exposed at 2021 AI Day

On Aug. 19 2021, Telsa held an AI day , exposing more technologies about Autopilot , from perception, planning, data labeling, simulation…

yuhuang-63908.medium.com

 

[fasteddie7]

Any 11.4.7.2 reviews?

Working on it now

 

[sleepydoc]

I don't understand the hate on Omar. I quite like his drive videos. It saves me a lot of testing and gives me what to expect for the drive around town. I happened to live in his neighborhood.

Also, I don't understand the junk business. Last weekend I drove from LA to SF and back. I found that FSD beta is much better than NOA/AP. On my long drive on I-5, I started to think we have to learn how to use FSD and find out how to help (assist) FSD to help (assist) ourselves. I was quite happy that FSD beta handled the whole route 152 quite well. Very comfortable drive. There are just so many different road conditions (just driving on I-5, a two lane each direction freeway) that I don't think the programmer can program all of them in, especially to our liking. I started to learn what the programmers strategies and set points for just passing a slow truck in Chill setting and at 70 mph speed limit. I began to formulate my own actions to make it fit to my liking (or safer to me with my driving abilities).

The main thing with Omar is how he always gushes about each FSD version. I do like the videos of his that I’ve watched, though, and I agree on the FSD bashing.

 

[Ramphex]

The main thing with Omar is how he always gushes about each FSD version. I do like the videos of his that I’ve watched, though, and I agree on the FSD bashing.

It would get pretty boring in here if people just came here and sucked FSD super hard like Omar does on Twatter…. The J Crew adds some variety to the mix.

 

[slevit1md]

Anyone else getting extremely annoyed with FSD beta? I’m currently on 11.4.7, and while it’s still mostly good for highway driving, I find it largely useless for anything else. Here are a few of my biggest annoyances:

1. as others have mentioned, the automatic windshield wipers are largely useless. They dry wipe all the time, and usually don’t wipe when I actually need them too.

2. The system cannot handle flashing yellow lights at all. Unfortunately, one of my frequent route home from work is full of flashing yellow signals, and the Tesla slams on the brakes and then immediately lets them off every time the yellow light flashes. I have no idea how they don’t have some kind of programming set up for flashing yellow lights – they’re not that uncommon.

3. When navigating on autopilot, if there is a right hand turn lane, even when the lines in the road are very clearly marked and the route very clearly goes straight ahead, autopilot often swerves into the turn lane. I have no idea why it would try to do this, but it does it frequently.

4. If I am on a 2+ lane road and there is another car slightly ahead of me that activates it’s turn signal to merge into my lane, the Tesla will brake pretty hard to let them in. I could understand the car letting them in if they are well ahead of me, but I certainly would not typically brake hard to let someone in.

5. Autopilot will pretty frequently, and for no apparent reason, slow down from the set speed. No one in front of me, no crazy shadows, it just slows down for no reason. Even if i hit the accelerator to take it back up to the set speed, when I let off it slows back down (usually by about 5-10 mph). Eventually it will go back to the set speed.

6. The stupid camera that looks at me is way too sensitive. Half the time, even changing a setting on the screen will cause it to say that I need to pay attention to the road. It went from preciously hardly nagging at all, to now nagging after like 3-5 seconds of looking away.

There are more, but these are probably my biggest issues. Almost makes me want to just disable it.

 

[aronth5]

....

On the camera issues, I'm not as negative as some above. There could be improvements, but the goal isn't to get perfectly visibility in every direction, at every angle. The goal is just to have at /least/ as good visibility as the average human driver, hopefully a little better. This is what roads are designed and improved around anyways. As long as the corner cases that are dangerous for FSD's cameras are the same ones that are dangerous for humans, you've met the goal and it's the road's fault if there's excess risk or need to slow down and look more.

It already wins on this in a lot of ways (because it can see 360 at the same time, and arguably has better night vision than most humans). But: I think there clearly /is/ a range of situations where a human driver, by leaning forward and turning their heads, can see cross-traffic better than the current repeater + B cameras do, even if the car manages to angle itself a bit for camera placement. That specific issue needs fixing, and I could see a number of ways to do it. The easiest would be to widen the angle of the repeaters towards the front, so that they can serve simultaneously both the blind-spot and cross-traffic needs.

The point you're missing is obstructed view intersections where FSD cannot see nearly as well as a human. Today is a perfect example. If you pinch in and look closely at the photo below you will notice a car is approaching. That was my view after creeping as far forward as I dared to. Obviously I didn't proceed. The B-pillar camera cannot see that car until it's much closer so when FSD makes a decision to go it's often the wrong decision. How do I know? Because I've had to hit the brakes hard to avoid pulling out right in front of the car or in one case an 18 wheeler. The B-pillar is obstructed by shrubs and a tree but because a human can lean forward there is no obstruction.

 

[Ramphex]

Anyone else getting extremely annoyed with FSD beta? I’m currently on 11.4.7, and while it’s still mostly good for highway driving, I find it largely useless for anything else. Here are a few of my biggest annoyances:

1. as others have mentioned, the automatic windshield wipers are largely useless. They dry wipe all the time, and usually don’t wipe when I actually need them too.

2. The system cannot handle flashing yellow lights at all. Unfortunately, one of my frequent route home from work is full of flashing yellow signals, and the Tesla slams on the brakes and then immediately lets them off every time the yellow light flashes. I have no idea how they don’t have some kind of programming set up for flashing yellow lights – they’re not that uncommon.

3. When navigating on autopilot, if there is a right hand turn lane, even when the lines in the road are very clearly marked and the route very clearly goes straight ahead, autopilot often swerves into the turn lane. I have no idea why it would try to do this, but it does it frequently.

4. If I am on a 2+ lane road and there is another car slightly ahead of me that activates it’s turn signal to merge into my lane, the Tesla will brake pretty hard to let them in. I could understand the car letting them in if they are well ahead of me, but I certainly would not typically brake hard to let someone in.

5. Autopilot will pretty frequently, and for no apparent reason, slow down from the set speed. No one in front of me, no crazy shadows, it just slows down for no reason. Even if i hit the accelerator to take it back up to the set speed, when I let off it slows back down (usually by about 5-10 mph). Eventually it will go back to the set speed.

6. The stupid camera that looks at me is way too sensitive. Half the time, even changing a setting on the screen will cause it to say that I need to pay attention to the road. It went from preciously hardly nagging at all, to now nagging after like 3-5 seconds of looking away.

There are more, but these are probably my biggest issues. Almost makes me want to just disable it.

Welcome to the club, feel free to refer to it as the J from now on, instead of FSD beta.

 

[Yelobird]

It would get pretty boring in here if people just came here and sucked FSD super hard like Omar does on Twatter…. The J Crew adds some variety to the mix.

Both are extremes that add little value.

 

[WilliamG]

I really hate driving my car right now. The wipers are about 95% broken. How has Tesla not rushed out an emergency fix for this?

 

[fasteddie7]

I really hate driving my car right now. The wipers are about 95% broken. How has Tesla not rushed out an emergency fix for this?

wonder If it doesn’t turn on by design so they can feed dojo all the footage of rain

 

[Pdubs]

Both are extremes that add little value.

They’re not trying to add value Freud. They’re posting impressions. Nothing in this thread adds value. It’s a bloody venting station. And given the status of the J and what we’ve been fed from on high, a much needed “value” is indeed added.

Save your one sentence psychobabble for reddit.

 

[Ramphex]

Both are extremes that add little value.

You know that you and Omar are on the same team right? Lol.

 

[Yelobird]

They’re not trying to add value Freud. They’re posting impressions. Nothing in this thread adds value. It’s a bloody venting station. And given the status of the J and what we’ve been fed from on high, a much needed “value” is indeed added.

Save your one sentence psychobabble for reddit.

Adding a Point provides an impression. Continuous babble would be the far right Omar or left the J squad. Neither provide Any contribution nor value to anything. Posting thousands of useless dribble statements is the definition of psychobabble. Nobody on this thread or forum contends that FSD is flawless yet some feel the need to grind through it daily like a masochistic self torcher to feel better about themselves in the pursuit of cheerleaders. Totally a great use of time and contribution. lol

 

[WilliamG]

Adding a Point provides an impression. Continuous babble would be the far right Omar or left the J squad. Neither provide Any contribution nor value to anything. Posting thousands of useless dribble statements is the definition of psychobabble. Nobody on this thread or forum contends that FSD is flawless yet some feel the need to grind through it daily like a masochistic self torcher to feel better about themselves in the pursuit of cheerleaders. Totally a great use of time and contribution. lol

The J squad in general actually provides countless evidence to show how J it really is. They do it daily. Omar does the complete opposite, touting unrepeatable edge cases or completely twisting the facts into something “positive,” like in this latest example where the car stopped in an intersection and ran a right-only lane by going straight ahead, yet proclaiming it to be god’s gift to get more plaudits from Elon. It’s idiotic, it’s the definition of a shill, and he does it all the time.

Moreover, J Squad actually provides useful information as it should be getting back to Tesla so they can fix this crap. We’re literally unpaid testers! Meanwhile, Omar provides nothing useful by just saying, “Look how awesome this is!”

Meanwhile, I had to drive home in the rain and manually use my wipers because my six-figure car has the worst wipers of any car in the history of cars with wipers, and Tesla doesn’t give a flying copulation.

 

[mgs333]

I actually don't have any issues with the wipers on 11.4.7. Even today as my windshield was splattered with bugs from driving on the 5 fwy between So Cal and NorCal. Phantom braking happened quite a few times when the sun was shining directly into the front camera at sunset.

 

[jebinc]

Rut roh. One report of wiper issues with 11.4.7.2. They need to fall on the sword and be done with it.

J

 

[jebinc]

The J squad in general actually provides countless evidence to show how J it really is. They do it daily. Omar does the complete opposite, touting unrepeatable edge cases or completely twisting the facts into something “positive,” like in this latest example where the car stopped in an intersection and ran a right-only lane by going straight ahead, yet proclaiming it to be god’s gift to get more plaudits from Elon. It’s idiotic, it’s the definition of a shill, and he does it all the time.

Moreover, J Squad actually provides useful information as it should be getting back to Tesla so they can fix this crap. We’re literally unpaid testers! Meanwhile, Omar provides nothing useful by just saying, “Look how awesome this is!”

Meanwhile, I had to drive home in the rain and manually use my wipers because my six-figure car has the worst wipers of any car in the history of cars with wipers, and Tesla doesn’t give a flying copulation.

Omar is a junk merchant!

 

[jebinc]

I don’t know that I can speak for everyone here but my “junk” status is almost entirely due to its performance in urban/city driving.

As you know I have my issues with FSD’s freeway performance but 95% of my dissatisfaction is how poorly the system performs in the city.

I’ve been screwing with FSDb for two years now and I am no more comfortable letting an inexperienced driver use FSDb today that I was in October of 2021. It has progressed not one iota towards actual usefulness in urban LA driving in that time.

If your FSD usage is focused on highway driving I can understand why you’re not nearly as unhappy as many of us.

It’s junkier than a junk bond.

 

[jebinc]

It would get pretty boring in here if people just came here and sucked FSD super hard like Omar does on Twatter…. The J Crew adds some variety to the mix.

I would say, “adds Reality to the mix”.

 

[jebinc]

Welcome to the club, feel free to refer to it as the J from now on, instead of FSD beta.

That’s FSDj for you.

 

[Ramphex]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1707011858866008171