Hold Steering Wheel every 20-25 seconds?

[barjohn]

I would like to see more test like a vehicle stopped at a light that was not in sight at the time it stopped. A vehicle suddenly pulling out from a parking spot and a vehicle crossing at an intersection so I can see how the car handles each situation. Then these videos would be more instructional than any words in a user manual. The dummy vehicles should have the same radar cross section and approximate visual size and shape.

 

[GeorgeSymonds]

Road deaths are on the rise again worldwide.
Distracted driving is the most probable cause.

US is around 1.1 to 1.2 VMT and has been for a decade.
The 10 years before it was 1.2 x 1.3
The 10 years before that it was 1.4+

The trend is down although I agree it’s slighyly up in the last year but still way down compared to a decade ago.

VMT (vehicle miles travelled) is the only meaningful stat and the basis Musk likes to use. But it’s still not the point, no computer is allowed to be in charge and there be a death, anywhere

 

[hill]

......snip.... after 3 beeps I think autosteer disables for the rest of the drive, even if you responded immediately to the beeps.

If one more person tells me to just drive with one hand or wiggle the wheel gently every 20 seconds I give up on humanity.

Another 10 & 2 driver here, or alternatively, 8 & 4. Both have gotten the AP disconnect when apparently my jiggle was insufficient. Meanwhile, watching the road closely has yielded folk cutting in where AP would seemingly respond too late, OR ... the infamous person in front of us dives out of the lane to avoid the very slow or nearly stopped person they swerved to avoid & again ... had the focus been on whether the blinking light was going on (rather than being aware of the road ahead, behind & on both sides) due to the 2 hands too light driving - it would not be pretty.
MAN! when the too many jiggle failures / disconnect happens - big red notice ... i wonder how long it'll be before someone gets distracted by that - trying to read what just happened & what it's all about, and the big red flash causes something horrible.
.

 

[SSonnentag]

Because we have to move. We are allowing more deaths in traffic than in any other every day activity.

If any other activity would cause so many deaths annually, it would be forbidden.

Motorcycles vs Automobiles - 35 times the death rate per mile riden/driven.
Alcohol, Tobacco, and other Drugs - 2,712,630 US deaths per year
All US vehicle deaths (2010) - 30,296

I think the nag messages are misguided.

 

[jgs]

By the way, I've noticed a big uptick in TACC flipping into "hold" mode with no apparent provocation, when fully stopped behind other traffic. Is it just me or part of the overall package of being more cautious?

 

[Marshallo]

This is how earlier (major) FW versions used to behave. Unfortunately, and likely due to the recent accidents that received a lot of media attention, the AP system went from what you describe to nanny-mode...

This latest software update is a joke.

We all paid 5K $ for autopilot and now with this latest software update by Tesla, we now have an autopilot system that doesn't work at all.
I always have my hands on the steering wheel when autopilot is enabled, but the software or sensors now do not capture that I am holding onto the steering when and it keeps on nagging. Driving me crazy!!!!

It's even worse since the dash screen no longer flashes on all four sides, but instead now only flashes on the top!.

Tesla software engineers what was your thinking on this last update????????

Autopilot enabled BOTH my hands on the steering wheel and the nag systems tells me to put my hands on the wheel (even though my hands are already on the wheel) and then disables autopilot for the rest of the drive! This keeps happening on my drive to work.
Its really starting to piss me off!

 

[jgs]

we now have an autopilot system that doesn't work at all.

What’s this “we”? Mine works fine. A little naggier I guess but really, not a big deal. I’d put it back if I could — I guess — but you can leave me out of “we all”.

I get that you’re upset. My point is, you’re quite mistaken to think everyone is.

 

[pedriscoll]

Actually, I believe that 10 and 2 is no longer a recommended hand position. The reason is that with the current airbags 10 and 2 will result in airbag deployment breaking your arms or driving them into your face in a collision.

 

[d21mike]

Another 10 & 2 driver here, or alternatively, 8 & 4. Both have gotten the AP disconnect when apparently my jiggle was insufficient. Meanwhile, watching the road closely has yielded folk cutting in where AP would seemingly respond too late, OR ... the infamous person in front of us dives out of the lane to avoid the very slow or nearly stopped person they swerved to avoid & again ... had the focus been on whether the blinking light was going on (rather than being aware of the road ahead, behind & on both sides) due to the 2 hands too light driving - it would not be pretty.
MAN! when the too many jiggle failures / disconnect happens - big red notice ... i wonder how long it'll be before someone gets distracted by that - trying to read what just happened & what it's all about, and the big red flash causes something horrible.
.

It has been reported here many times that "jiggle" is not the correct way to remove the warning. I think some have a legitimate complaint but this is not one of them. Sounds like you want to just find a reason to complain. If you are serious about learning to use the technology correctly there are many posts that explain it clearly.

 

[hill]

(oh boy ... ) sorry i used a word that bothered you more than it ought to be bothering anyone ... ok?
Rephrase ... not a jiggle ... ie, not a really fast moving sort ... rather a slightly slower, maybe 2x per second back & forth, coupled w/ a bit o pressure one way or the other. Better?
ok? there .... can i be absolved of the 'complainer' branding now?
(sheesh)
i mean it's great to be a fan of our cars - but really? flinging the complainer label out?
it's not like our X has been in the shop for over 6 weeks of the last 13K miles (or wait ... it has ) and our prior tesla? the S, didn't make it home before the air suspension went ka-put. (sigh) no ... I won't complain until the car dies 1/2 way across the Mojave ... because god forbid, I'd hate to be branded a complainer ... it's not about customer satisfaction ... it's protect the rep of the car at all cost. Can I please have another glass of Kool aid now?

 

[rnortman]

Rephrase ... not a jiggle ... ie, not a really fast moving sort ... rather a slightly slower, maybe 2x per second back & forth, coupled w/ a bit o pressure one way or the other. Better?

First, let me say that I am a complainer myself. I am very dissatisfied with this update as it makes Autosteer largely useless for me, especially on long straight highway runs (which is really where you would want Autosteer to shine!).

That said, if you want to prevent or dismiss the nags, there is no need for back-and-forth, and in fact any back-and-forth motion is probably counter productive. The most reliable thing is consistent light pressure in one direction for around a second, or until the nag disappears. Going back and forth it seems can result in the pressure averaging out to zero, at least in the way that they read it. I'm sure they need to filter the signal over time though some sort of low-pass filter to get rid of noise; therefore any kind of back-and-forth may get averaged out. The faster you go back and forth the most it looks like noise to the system.

Now, back to complaining -- even though I have just explained how to reliably work around the problem, it is still completely ridiculous that this workaround is required, and even more ridiculous that you can more reliably avoid the nags with one hand on the wheel than you can with two hands on the wheel (in, e.g., the recommended 8 and 4 positions).

Fellow complainers, please don't just complain here, but complain to Tesla directly. I haven't gotten a response so far, but the more people who complain (politely, and being sure to point out that you have both hands on the wheel and it can't detect that), the sooner they will do something about this.

 

[GeorgeSymonds]

The most reliable thing is consistent light pressure in one direction for around a second, or until the nag disappears. .

This - I rest my elbow on the door, my hand on the wheel and I let the wheel take the weight of my forearm. Works fine.

I always hold the wheel (well maybe the odd second when I don't) as I find it reassuring to feel the wheel twitch as it steers, and I've known it start to head for the barrier and my hand felt it before my eyesight saw it, so an extra half a second to regain control.

 

[Dameon]

My bean bag quit working. I need a heavier bean bag.

I always push updates further and further out... at some point it just does it. Region? VIN? Model? Whatever the factor, I can't stop updates from eventually happening.

 

[f205v]

My bean bag quit working. I need a heavier bean bag.

I made a few tests yesterday night. I prepared a few calibrated bags of sand 100g 200g and 400g, so I could do any combination from 100g to 700g.
I did my test on a stretch of highway which comprise both some long straights and a series of right/left bends on a total lenght of 20Km.
I was suspending the bags with an hook to the rightmost point of the wheel ray, where it connects to the wheel ring (immediately above to the right scroll whell + buttons)
I started from the lightest weight and progressively increased it till I got no more nags.
The I repeated the process starting from the heaviest weight and progressively reducing it till I got no nags.
I both cases I got to a point where 400g (0.88lbs) was doing the trick: i.e. no nags in any situation: straight road, bending road, change of lane.
300g was enough to avoid nags on a straight, but the car started nagging me if I wanted to change lane, or if I was in a long bend.

I'm curious about what weight others should use, I think that different models/years have different tresholds.

 

[rnortman]

I made a few tests yesterday night. I prepared a few calibrated bags of sand 100g 200g and 400g, so I could do any combination from 100g to 700g.
[...]
I'm curious about what weight others should use, I think that different models/years have different tresholds.

Thanks for bringing the science, but you forgot to mention what your test vehicle is (model, options, and month/year of delivery).

So here's the test I want to see -- simulate two hands on the wheel by hanging equal weights from both sides. See how much weight is required to avoid the nags on straight roads and curvy roads.

Spoiler alert: It doesn't matter how much weight you add. No amount of weight will work reliably on straight roads! This is the fatal flaw in this design.

 

[boonedocks]

Thanks for bringing the science, but you forgot to mention what your test vehicle is (model, options, and month/year of delivery).

So here's the test I want to see -- simulate two hands on the wheel by hanging equal weights from both sides. See how much weight is required to avoid the nags on straight roads and curvy roads.

Spoiler alert: It doesn't matter how much weight you add. No amount of weight will work reliably on straight roads! This is the fatal flaw in this design.

Agree 100% I don't continue to turn my steering wheel or apply "light force" when traveling miles and miles of straight roads. That is indeed where EAP is failing. I have to be drive completely unnaturally against EAP to keep the nags away on straight roads.

 

[TomServo]

Right now my reason to buy a CPO Tesla with AP1 would be purely for TACC. I have this feature on both our GM cars and won't own/operate a car with out it. The "self steering" feature is nothing I'd considering using. So am glad I can just activate TACC w/o the self-steering feature.

 

[rnortman]

Right now my reason to buy a CPO Tesla with AP1 would be purely for TACC. I have this feature on both our GM cars and won't own/operate a car with out it. The "self steering" feature is nothing I'd considering using. So am glad I can just activate TACC w/o the self-steering feature.

TACC is getting a little obnoxious as well. Because they're trying to make it stop for stopped cars (after some high-profile accidents involving slamming into stopped cars), it is very jittery and often slows down abruptly due to false positives. This is even if you're not using Autosteer. I hope this will get better with time as they start to rely on the cameras more and the radar less, but as of right now I would say the adaptive cruise control experience is better in other modern cars with this feature than it is in Teslas because they don't really even try to stop for stopped cars unless the lead car comes to a stop while you are following it. This works well with radar and avoids the false positive issues.

 

[jgs]

TACC is getting a little obnoxious as well.

I don't find this at all, possibly because I'm driving AP1 and you're driving AP2.5.

 

[rnortman]

I don't find this at all, possibly because I'm driving AP1 and you're driving AP2.5.

Does AP1 stop for stopped cars? I mean if you come up on cars that are already stopped; I know it stops if you are following a lead car which comes to a stop.