M3 Refresh - Are Indicator buttons really poor design?

[page3]

I just remembered why we went to war against the British.

Remind me, who won that one?

We did. We just let you think you did.

 

[Unclepaul]

I have these buttons on my X. Learn to use them easily, pretty quickly.

I am glad that they are putting the horn button back in the center pad of the steering wheel though.

Getting rid of stalks will save $Millions in parts costs, make assembly easier and quicker. Allow Tesla to remain cost effective and able to turn out millions of great electric vehicles.

It really cleans up the interior and improves sight lines. When FSD becomes a familiar technology, stalks will be relegated to history.

I believe that up to now, Tesla has been buying those stalks from Mercedes. Had to be expensive.

 

[ACarneiro]

I just remembered why we went to war against the British.

Remind me, who won that one?

You went to war over indicator stalks?

 

[MrT3]

I believe that up to now, Tesla has been buying those stalks from Mercedes. Had to be expensive.

They did on the old MS but the M3/MY has cheap and nasty stalks that I believe are built in house.

 

[Zilla91]

When FSD becomes a familiar technology

 

[Mrklaw]

I have these buttons on my X. Learn to use them easily, pretty quickly.

I am glad that they are putting the horn button back in the center pad of the steering wheel though.

Getting rid of stalks will save $Millions in parts costs, make assembly easier and quicker. Allow Tesla to remain cost effective and able to turn out millions of great electric vehicles.

It really cleans up the interior and improves sight lines. When FSD becomes a familiar technology, stalks will be relegated to history.

I believe that up to now, Tesla has been buying those stalks from Mercedes. Had to be expensive.

Millions? How much do we think these parts cost? let’s put three wheels on the car instead of four, it’ll save more millions. At some point there is safety to consider

 

[kpanda17]

I just saw the M3 refresh video on Fully Charged and I think I saw that the left and right indicator controls have been made buttons on the steering wheel. Am I the only one to think this is really bad design?

Imagine the scenario when you are approaching a roundabout and you want to take the right hand exit (ie normally 3rd or 4th exit in the UK).
As you approach you use your left hand to press the button with the right arrow on it - so far so good.
You turn the steering wheel as you go round the roundabout.
As you approach your exit and want to indicate left, with steering wheel turned, your indicator buttons are now on the other side of the steering wheel - so unusually you need to press the buttons with your right hand. But hold on. Their upside down!! The arrow symbol on the left indicator is pointing right and the arrow on the right indicator is pointing left. Not only that but the bottom button is now on top and the top button is on the bottom.
Now I appreciate many people don’t indicate correctly at roundabouts anyway but I can’t see this ‘development’ helping much.
I guess people will soon get used to it.
Call me old fashioned but I think I prefer the good old indicator stalk that just stays where it’s meant to be.

No problem with no stalks
I just drove a MS
No adjustment problems

 

[shahryaran]

I just saw the M3 refresh video on Fully Charged and I think I saw that the left and right indicator controls have been made buttons on the steering wheel. Am I the only one to think this is really bad design?

Imagine the scenario when you are approaching a roundabout and you want to take the right hand exit (ie normally 3rd or 4th exit in the UK).
As you approach you use your left hand to press the button with the right arrow on it - so far so good.
You turn the steering wheel as you go round the roundabout.
As you approach your exit and want to indicate left, with steering wheel turned, your indicator buttons are now on the other side of the steering wheel - so unusually you need to press the buttons with your right hand. But hold on. Their upside down!! The arrow symbol on the left indicator is pointing right and the arrow on the right indicator is pointing left. Not only that but the bottom button is now on top and the top button is on the bottom.
Now I appreciate many people don’t indicate correctly at roundabouts anyway but I can’t see this ‘development’ helping much.
I guess people will soon get used to it.
Call me old fashioned but I think I prefer the good old indicator stalk that just stays where it’s meant to be.

Stalk or no stalk argument [not] settled

First, we should analyze the matter without considering that the brand Tesla is making these changes and understand from a automotive/ engineering/ ergonomic point of view that whether indicator in steering has benefits compare to stalk. If it does, I'll accept that. Obviously there is always...

teslamotorsclub.com

 

[ACarneiro]

No problem with no stalks
I just drove a MS
No adjustment problems

Again, I’m not sure you can extrapolate a driving experience in the US with what we’re likely to find in the UK.
In principle I think it’s a terrible idea for multiple reasons, but I suppose the proof of the pudding is in the eating so will be looking forward to hearing people’s experiences when it eventually lands here.

 

[kpanda17]

Again, I’m not sure you can extrapolate a driving experience in the US with what we’re likely to find in the UK.
In principle I think it’s a terrible idea for multiple reasons, but I suppose the proof of the pudding is in the eating so will be looking forward to hearing people’s experiences when it eventually lands here.

Someone brought up the issue of putting on the turn signal when exiting a roundabout
Agree it would be a challenge to hit the turn signal while turning the steering wheel

 

[Lord Farquad]

Someone brought up the issue of putting on the turn signal when exiting a roundabout
Agree it would be a challenge to hit the turn signal while turning the steering wheel

Almost like the designers live in a country devoid of roundabouts……

 

[randompixel]

Almost like the designers live in a country devoid of roundabouts……

Next time anyone gets a design bigwig on a podcast they need to ask about the history of this choice

 

[kpanda17]

Reading your calc
I should be at 76 kw capacity
When new it was at 78.1 kw
2.7% degradation?
It’s in the driveway saying at 85% 241 miles
New 303 miles for 100%, 85% 257 miles
Now 85% 241 miles
Difference 6.4% degradation
Vs your 2.7%
3.7% less
Did I understand correctly?
Thoughts on rhe bigger degradation? I have only rebalanced rhe pack once so far
Doing every three months

 

[Jason71]

Almost like the designers live in a country devoid of roundabouts……

The US has one roundabout for every 500miles of road.
The UK one for every 10 miles.
My daughter is learning to drive, we went out driving for an hour last night. I counted how many roundabouts we traversed. 36 was the final score.
I am sure i could cope with the new buttons but its making life harder for no obvoius reason. If its cost saving? How many speakers do i need to give up to get the stalk back? 3? 7?

 

[LiamPope]

If you've ever tried to change volume or skip music track with the steering wheel up-side-down - well, you don't, do you, you just give up trying and wait till the wheel is back to centre - then you already know how much indicators on the wheel will suck! Especially here in Europe with small roundabouts everywhere where up-side-down is right about where the wheel is when you want to indicate to exit!

The screen wash/wipe button moving around is almost as annoying. Shifting gears, on the other hand, I don't think that'd bother me tooo much to be honest. The column shifter is still kinda new to me, so I could let it go, and the area of the screen you will swipe to shift instead is so close (for me in LHD land) it doesn't seem all that different. Big change in action for RHD though to move from the column shift to screen, although it'll be close to going back to a regular car with centre gear lever. If the auto shifting is intelligent enough that you actually shift much less anyway, that'll help too.

 

[Billbrown1982]

We wouldn't even be having this discussion if it was BMW doing it.

 

[Mrklaw]

If its cost saving? How many speakers do i need to give up to get the stalk back? 3? 7?

ooh nice.

I honestly hope thye get push back and like the yoke on the S/X, there is a change and they put them back - keep the damn buttons if you want and check your analytics for how often people use them vs stalks..

if Enhance autos don’t come out with a seamless option, I think this is the end of the road for tesla and me. Seems silly to be over a bit of plastic althoug the USS were already really irritating

 

[pdk42]

I just remembered why we went to war against the British.

Remind me, who won that one?

Well actually, the war of independence was between British settlers loyal to the king and British settlers who weren’t. It was only afterwards that American identity became established. But my original point wasn’t intended to be anti-American (I lived in MA for three years and am quite an Ameriphile, if that’s word) - just that the US road system makes removing stalks a potential workable idea. In the UK (and many other European countries), it’s just really not going to work.

 

[pdk42]

We wouldn't even be having this discussion if it was BMW doing it.

Yes we would. Stupid ideas transcend who originated them.

 

[robbieduncan]

Some of the may depend on how you drive. It you are a wheel shuffler (standard Uk technique) this may be annoying. If you’ve ever done a track day and had tuition you might keep your hands in a fixed place on the wheel and (shock horror) cross your arms. Then it might be fine

Unleash your inner race driver!