Save a few $$$ by scrapping the stalks that get used on every single journey, and spend that money on a rear screen that no one needs or asked for and will hardly get touched. Obviously I am aware it doesn't exactly work like that but still...
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M3 Refresh - Are Indicator buttons really poor design?
- Thread starter Timbo13
- Start date
WannabeOwner
Well-Known Member
USA is a bigger country, but they have 50% the number of roundabouts as UK - not exactly "devoid"
I don't think that's a reasonable review of the figures
Majority of the USA roundabouts are clustered in a handful of states, and the rest of the states have very few. I expect forum chatter in those traffic-circle states sounds a lot like UK chatter.
Probably worth noting BMW are moving this way too. From BMW’s Neue Klasse points to a radical reinvention for future sedans “That's paired with controls integrated into the steering wheel plus what BMW promises is a new level of voice interactivity and control.” and take a look at the image: no stalks. This is a concept car but BMW are calling this out as their future direction
Jason71
Well-Known Member
This is a Tesla forum so probably not.
Screen is reversed on RHD so the control will be next to the hand, so the big change is only the left hand and not the right needed to operate it.
Jason71
Well-Known Member
You are right its not fair.
Tesla's main bases of operations are in California and Texas.
Texas has around 300 roundabouts so that's one roundabout for 2300 miles of road
California has about 40 roundabouts in total so that's one roundabout for every 10,000 miles of road
That is probably more relevant
WannabeOwner
Well-Known Member
Indeed, but I still think Tesla have enough "local" sales to States that have enough roundabouts for punters to be vocal, and for testers / designers to be aware.
Not sure UK PLC have to shout loudest for this to be heard - but that seems to be the route we are on ...
I think the punters *are* vocal but Tesla don't care, they see only sales figures. The only way to change their mind is simply to not buy one.
LiamPope
Member
That's all good if Teslas have race car quick steering racks with less than 360 degrees lock to lock. Sadly they don't. Keeping your hands on the wheel at 3/9, the hand that goes over the top can turn with the wheel about 180 degrees and still feasibly use thumb buttons, but the hand that goes underneath will twist out of place around 90 degrees. 180 degrees comes pretty quickly - negotiating a typical UK B road roundabout. So no problem if we only want to turn right. Yokes and steering wheel controls only really work well on a road car if it has drive by wire and can therefore vary the steering ratio as required such that you only ever need to turn the wheel less than 180 degrees either way. See Toyota/Lexus.
OK I needed a minute to stop barfing at how hideous that car is. Good lord! I used to love BMWs! So we can say very little about the technical spec of that car, but I'd wager BMW, like Toyota/Lexus above, aren't stupid enough to go for a daft shaped wheel and no stalks until they have drive by wire.
Jason71
Well-Known Member
So what are you suggesting?
a) they are aware, have done their due diligence, tested in places with lots of roundabouts and think its a non issue. i.e. people will get used to it
or
b) they are aware but don't care if its an issue since they think people will continue to buy the cars anyway?
WannabeOwner
Well-Known Member
Yup, either of those
I think the c) option that they don't know is extremely unlikely. Outside chance that the boss is, now, surrounded by a bunch of Yes-People and no one is speaking up ... but I think that unlikely, its not like he's going to blow up their private plane.
So they know, and they think they have a good reason for ignoring that problem. That might be that there is an ultra cool software/voice solution just around the corner ... which might actually materialise in a sometime-never timeframe. Or they will volte-face.
Personally I'm happy with owning & driving Tesla, I'm reluctant to change, if I find the non-stalks an issue I'll buy a 3rd party fix. The good news is that enough people hate the idea of no-stalks that there is a market for a 3rd party add-on.
Personally I hate the door handles, inside and out, because I have to explain to every new passenger how to operate them. That's a fail in my book - similar to when marketing decide to differentiate their product and change the shopping basket to some other icon imagery, or put the menus at the bottom instead of the top. Change for change sake
Zilla91
Active Member
Maybe they'll offer a free neuralink brain implant so that we can operate the indicators by the power of thought
Or possibly c) they are hoping to capture a larger segment of the company car market from Audi/BMW etc who don't use indicators anyway so it doesn't matter
MrBadger
Badger out
Maybe they'll offer a free neuralink brain implant so that we can operate the indicators by the power of thought
Yep. Be careful what you wish for.
Wow, what a lot of people forming strong opinions without trying something. While I can't really see why Tesla felt a need to innovate in this area, I'm prepared to try it and to be honest I think it's something I'll be able to learn to use.
Lol at the people claiming they are turning the wheel 180 degrees while on a roundabout and feeding the wheel between their hands, and then need to indicate to take a turning. I do think you are imaging a scenario that never exists, and no you wouldn't normally indicate to leave a mini roundabout (nor would you turn that tightly.
Lol at the people claiming they are turning the wheel 180 degrees while on a roundabout and feeding the wheel between their hands, and then need to indicate to take a turning. I do think you are imaging a scenario that never exists, and no you wouldn't normally indicate to leave a mini roundabout (nor would you turn that tightly.
Jason71
Well-Known Member
If Tesla had come up with something innovative or new that they thought was better I would be cynical but I would applaud them for trying. This is not that. This is just cost saving.
Buttons on Steering wheels have been a thing for a long time. The reason indicators are not on the steering wheel on most cars is not because no one thought of it or the technology did not exist to do it, its because no one thinks its a good idea.
Have Tesla even said anything to the effect of why they think this is a good design? or are they staying silent?
Others have tried alternatives to the indicator stalk e.g. the Citroen BX but in the end they all came back to the stalk because if just worked.
People have said they don't think it will be a problem but I have yet to hear anyone ( who does not live on a grid) who has actually offered any reason why this will be better. And we can think of lots of a few good reasons why it will be worse. So yes I am very sceptical.
The existing stalk design is bad enough since means that if you are on a roundabout signalling right and want to signal left you have to indicate twice since the first attempt just cancels. This is unlike any other car I have ever driven and I find that small difference really annoying. And what tells me is that Tesla don't understand or don't care about roundabouts ergo I do not have high hopes for this change.
more than happy to be proved wrong.
Have you tried it though?
There do seem to be a lot of Americans who think it's just fine, and I don't really believe that it would be a big issue on roundabouts (they do have plenty of them in the US anyway, see Roundabouts Database Map).
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