Major Phantom Braking Issues

[LucLamma]

Hi guys,

Just wanted to share an experience that I've had today so that others looking at Teslas to use for long distance driving can make an informed decision.

My wife and I drove our 2023 MYLR from Tucson to Las Vegas. It's a ~7 hour drive (8.5 with charging stops, ~400 miles) mostly through an open desert highway. Traffic is minimal and driving an ICE car is easy on cruise control. Most of the drive is going straight on a highway. We've done it dozens of times since we travel between the two spots often and is a reason we got a Tesla.

The car is 6 days old and running the latest software. During our trip we experienced 19 phantom breaking incidents where the car decided to break at highway speeds for no reason. In all cases there were no cars or obstructions in the way and this occurred at various stretches of the trip. The breaking was very aggressive.

After the first few phantom breaking events we started disabling various "autopilot" features such as emergency breaking, etc. In the end, nothing made a difference and the phantom breaking was occurring even on regular "cruise control" (one pull down) with all other features disabled.

To summarize, the experience was unpleasant and dangerous. If at any time during the phantom breaking event there was a car following us closely there would have been an accident. I do not feel safe operating this vehicle with any type of "autopilot" feature because it's unsafe and behaves erratically.

I know people will say that this is all "beta" and "experimental" and I should always be ready to take over, and of course that part is correct. But when the car breaks suddenly at highway speeds for no reason "taking over" is difficult, especially if this behavior creates an accident. Furthermore, the expectation is that it's 2022 and even the simplest of vehicles offer a cruise control that doesn't slam its breaks on the highway.

I'd be curious to know if others have the same issue. I feel like this is a SERIOUS safety problem and now I am very weary of my Tesla.

Luca

 

[Killer Junior]

Following

 

[jjrandorin]

The car is 6 days old and running the latest software.

And what software version is that, exactly? While its not unheard of, its actually very very rare for a brand new car to actually have "the latest software" because they absolutely, positively 100% are not delivered with it. You would have had to have gotten a software update since you picked up the car, and it still might not be "the latest".

 

[jjrandorin]

I'd be curious to know if others have the same issue.

If thats actually true (you are curious to know if others have the same issue), there is an entire subforum here that is EXTREMELY EXTREMELY active, that discusses nothing but autopilot, and FSD features, experiences etc:

AI, Autopilot, & Autonomous/FSD

Discussion about AI, Tesla Bot, Tesla Autopilot (AP), the promise of Full Self Driving (FSD), as well as other Autonomous Vehicles.

teslamotorsclub.com

 

[LucLamma]

My version number is 2022.40.200. When I gave the vehicle wifi access it indicates that this is the latest version and I have "Advanced" updates disabled.

 

[KJD]

Hi guys,

Just wanted to share an experience that I've had today so that others looking at Teslas to use for long distance driving can make an informed decision.

My wife and I drove our 2023 MYLR from Tucson to Las Vegas. It's a ~7 hour drive (8.5 with charging stops, ~400 miles) mostly through an open desert highway. Traffic is minimal and driving an ICE car is easy on cruise control. Most of the drive is going straight on a highway. We've done it dozens of times since we travel between the two spots often and is a reason we got a Tesla.

The car is 6 days old and running the latest software. During our trip we experienced 19 phantom breaking incidents where the car decided to break at highway speeds for no reason. In all cases there were no cars or obstructions in the way and this occurred at various stretches of the trip. The breaking was very aggressive.

After the first few phantom breaking events we started disabling various "autopilot" features such as emergency breaking, etc. In the end, nothing made a difference and the phantom breaking was occurring even on regular "cruise control" (one pull down) with all other features disabled.

To summarize, the experience was unpleasant and dangerous. If at any time during the phantom breaking event there was a car following us closely there would have been an accident. I do not feel safe operating this vehicle with any type of "autopilot" feature because it's unsafe and behaves erratically.

I know people will say that this is all "beta" and "experimental" and I should always be ready to take over, and of course that part is correct. But when the car breaks suddenly at highway speeds for no reason "taking over" is difficult, especially if this behavior creates an accident. Furthermore, the expectation is that it's 2022 and even the simplest of vehicles offer a cruise control that doesn't slam its breaks on the highway.

I'd be curious to know if others have the same issue. I feel like this is a SERIOUS safety problem and now I am very weary of my Tesla.

Luca

I would agree this is a serious problem. My car is a 2021 Model Y long range and the software version is 2022.44.2.

It seems to me that the updates of the last 3 or 4 months have made this problem worse not better.

 

[LucLamma]

I would agree this is a serious problem. My car is a 2021 Model Y long range and the software version is 2022.44.2.

It seems to me that the updates of the last 3 or 4 months have made this problem worse not better.

Thanks for the heads up!

 

[zoomer0056]

regular "cruise control" (one pull down)

That is TACC, traffic aware cruise control. It's one feature of autopilot pilot. The other feature is autosteer. I don't use TACC anymore. The car hit the brakes a couple of times in my 2022 MSLR quickly slowing the car from 60mph to 40mph. Once for a car parked safely on the shoulder and once for a bicyclist safely riding off the road. I trained myself to anticipate these scenarios and disengage TACC. But it was too mentally draining. It's safer and more enjoyable without TACC. I do better than TAAC.

 

[jjrandorin]

My version number is 2022.40.200. When I gave the vehicle wifi access it indicates that this is the latest version and I have "Advanced" updates disabled.

That absolutely is not "the latest version" its just the latest one thats available for your vehicle. Of course, phantom braking happens on all versions but more on some and less on others.

That is a factory firmware version though so no, you dont have the latest version, and there is no way to force it to update faster).

 

[LucLamma]

That absolutely is not "the latest version" its just the latest one thats available for your vehicle. Of course, phantom braking happens on all versions but more on some and less on others.

That is a factory firmware version though so no, you dont have the latest version, and there is no way to force it to update faster).

I have the latest version that my vehicle supports, so yes, I do have the latest version.

You are taking a hostile position on a topic that's of importance to current and future Tesla vehicle owners.

If I knew this was such a serious and dangerous issue I would not have purchased this vehicle for use on our long trip. One way of preventing others from making the same mistake and possibly saving them from an accident is to make them aware of the problem and not CONCEAL it.

 

[ord3r]

Im on a similar version, no phantom breaks so far, seems like a lot of folks have it though. There’s an NHTSA investigation ongoing, hopefully Tesla can get it fixed.

 

[enable20011]

Usually this happens when there is shadow of the bridge over the freeway, I'm on the latest FSD Beta software and my commute daily is around 30 miles on the highway and never had a phantom braking...hopefully Tesla fixes this for non-FSD vehicles asap.

 

[SSonnentag]

My S with FSD Beta does the exact same thing with tons of phantom braking events (Note that it’s braking, not breaking). Our X with EAP and no FSD Beta never has phantom braking events. The difference is the radar. FSD Beta disables the radar.

 

[jjrandorin]

I have the latest version that my vehicle supports, so yes, I do have the latest version.

You are taking a hostile position on a topic that's of importance to current and future Tesla vehicle owners.

If I knew this was such a serious and dangerous issue I would not have purchased this vehicle for use on our long trip. One way of preventing others from making the same mistake and possibly saving them from an accident is to make them aware of the problem and not CONCEAL it.

How is it hostile to say "no you dont have the latest version" when its a fact that you dont have the latest version, and direct you to the subforum that has this discussion when you say "I wonder if anyone else experiences this"?

I also said "it occurs in every version", so no, I dont agree about being hostile.

Here are some other feedback links on the topic you are talking about, that already exist on this website for people to find, with this exact same feedback you are giving. There is no "CONCEALING going on here. All these are on the same topic, with the same feedback as you, just different software versions and different levels of discussion:

Phantom Braking

Smoke alarms can alert when there’s no fire, burglar alarms can go off when there’s no burglar, and AEB can brake when there’s nothing there. These systems are not defective, they are experiencing false triggers. Every detection system is susceptible to them. I drove a 2016 Sonata for many...

teslamotorsclub.com

Phantom Brake Crash?

https://www.ktvu.com/news/multi-car-crashes-disrupt-thanksgiving-day-travel-on-bay-bridges I'm not trolling but ran across this. I wonder if it could be related to a phantom braking incident. Was hoping maybe locals had additional insight. The San Francisco Fire Department said six people...

teslamotorsclub.com

My solution to “fix” phantom braking

To me, this is the single biggest issue that I have with FSD and it’s the reason that I am so reluctant to use it when there are cars behind me. I hit the camera icon on the screen whenever there is an event, but how does the development team know what the event was and why I’m sending them...

teslamotorsclub.com

How to deal with phantom braking?

When driving along the motorway, I get a few phantom braking incidents for each hour of driving (roughly and on average). I totally understand this happens to everyone so I'm not alone but a few questions. What's the best way to deal with this in terms of reporting? I sometimes disengage AP...

teslamotorsclub.com

TACC “vision only” on radar equipped Model 3 … phantom braking getting scary

This weekend was the first road-trip since May and oh boy is TACC vision only different than the older radar enabled versions for my 2019 Model 3. We were driving back from Llano Texas after a fun weekend in Fredericksburg and the roads from Llano to Fort Worth are primarily small country roads...

teslamotorsclub.com

My solution to “fix” phantom braking

To me, this is the single biggest issue that I have with FSD and it’s the reason that I am so reluctant to use it when there are cars behind me. I hit the camera icon on the screen whenever there is an event, but how does the development team know what the event was and why I’m sending them...

teslamotorsclub.com

Poll : Highway Phantom Braking Frequency

Here is a poll to crowdsource Highway Phantom Braking experience stats. This is for Vision only - so you should either have no-radar Tesla or you are on FSD Beta. By frequent, I mean, it is so much that it actually prevents you from using AP on highways or you take precautions when using it...

teslamotorsclub.com

Anyone else having trouble with Traffic-Aware Cruise Control?

Another new problem: passenger window failed to retract after open, it damaged the windows frame!! It would appear that you have a hardware failure at the root of your cruise control and window issues.

teslamotorsclub.com

Phantom braking when a car is following you.

Near my house is a spot on a 45 MPH highway where 10.69.2.2 always puts on the brakes, hard. It almost comes to a stop before picking up speed again. I've reported it multiple times. Today there was a car behind me for the first time. When I reached the phantom braking spot, instead of...

teslamotorsclub.com

There are more as well.

 

[Pianewman]

I guess the OP, when he started to write this new thread, chose to ignore that the forum informed him of all of the multiple ongoing threads on "phantom braking."

Thanks, jjrandorin, for keeping your cool, stating facts, and NOT becoming hostile.

 

[ElectricAnt54]

Hi guys,

Just wanted to share an experience that I've had today so that others looking at Teslas to use for long distance driving can make an informed decision.

My wife and I drove our 2023 MYLR from Tucson to Las Vegas. It's a ~7 hour drive (8.5 with charging stops, ~400 miles) mostly through an open desert highway. Traffic is minimal and driving an ICE car is easy on cruise control. Most of the drive is going straight on a highway. We've done it dozens of times since we travel between the two spots often and is a reason we got a Tesla.
The car is 6 days old and running the latest software. During our trip we experienced 19 phantom breaking incidents where the car decided to break at highway speeds for no reason. In all cases there were no cars or obstructions in the way and this occurred at various stretches of the trip. The breaking was very aggressive.
I'd be curious to know if others have the same issue. I feel like this is a SERIOUS safety problem and now I am very weary of my Tesla.

Luca

Nope. I love using autopilot + auto steer beta during my highway driving. I use it almost every day and starting to use it at night a bit. I've driven multiple long distance drives up and down California. Perhaps all I had was one or two events where it slowed down a bit but never slamming on brakes for no reason.

 

[BitJam]

After the first few phantom breaking events we started disabling various "autopilot" features such as emergency breaking, etc. In the end, nothing made a difference and the phantom breaking was occurring even on regular "cruise control" (one pull down) with all other features disabled.

A pro-active approach is to rest your foot lightly on the accelerator. Then gently press the accelerator when the phantom braking starts.

Depending on the weather and the angle of the sun I've noticed spates of phantom braking events in the desert that seemed to be caused by mirages. I haven't had much phantom braking recently but when I did I could usually find the cause and then be prepared to gently press the accelerator when I see a situation that might cause phantom braking.

 

[Dennisis]

Not "concealed" at all, obvious to anyone reading the forums - I'm sure you saw yourself as you were starting this new thread. I know it's disconcerting as I recently had multiple incidents myself while driving through Utah. I'm surprised you made it to 19 before you stopped using it, more patient than me. Keep in mind these are software issues and they should be resolved via updates in the hopefully near future.

 

[golferguy]

People need to stop stating "latest software" and just put in the release number. 3 of us with the same vehicle may have yet 3 different software releases. One might be FSD, one might be what came with new car delivery and the third could be yet a different release due to a regional rollout.

And the Tesla screen that you have the latest means nothing to the next person. At 8am you may have the latest and at 12noon something else gets pushed. And then the "latest" in the post after a few days is certainly not current.

 

[rwiegand]

Having read *lots* of threads on phantom braking over quite a while now I'd have to say there is no evidence for any software version having any effect on this problem. It seems that some people/cars are much more afflicted than others; this has been true in all the time I've been reading about Teslas.
The only incident I've had of inappropriate hard braking in ~5K miles so far is when a plastic bag blew across the road in front of the car. I can't really fault the car for that.
The assertion that this issue is in any way concealed is absurd. It's all over both the specialty forums like this one and being trumpeted in the anti-Tesla/EV popular press. You'd have to have been living in a cave (or being a willfully ignorant troll) to have missed it.