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Mirror not folding out completely

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I'm also having this problem, S60D delivered August 10th 2016. I actually had the same damn mirror replaced at the SC in Devon a few months ago, noticed a few days later it was still happening. Starting to make me think it might be software related.

Or maybe they replaced a dud with a dud. Ah well, not important enough to go back to the SC before I need to. I should probably just call and let them know so they don't hassle me about it.
 
I have the same issue with our 90D (delivery end of September). Both mirrors have the problem, but not consistently. It seems more prone to have the problem when the weather is extremely cold. Most of the time it would not extend out fully, but I've also seen them not folding fully when parked (I have the auto fold setting ON when walking away from the car).

I'm a little hesitant to call and bring it to the SC, because I'm not sure if I can demonstrate the problem since it doesn't always happen. :oops:
 
I have the same problem (some slack after mirror unfolds) on my passenger side window, perhaps about 20% of the time of the autofold. sept 2016 build. I had brought this up with the SC in my last visit about two weeks ago. He said it could be the motor in the mirror (unlikely), or the controller in the door area (one that sends the command to the mirror motor), could be s/w issue. When I picked up the car after the vibration fix, the note on the receipt was simply "felt cloth cleaned, may not fix issue completely, a s/w udpate would be the next option". So they left it as is - I was happy with the steering vibration fix and didn't bother to keep the car there longer even if I reproduced the issue again.

Well - let's see if the upcoming 8.1 s/w fixes this issue.
 
Never happened to me on pre-facelift. But admittedly, I hardly use the folding mirrors. Don't really need them they just came with a package of other stuff that I did want.

Here's my guess as to what's going on...

Hardware is fine and software is functioning "fine" (working as expected).
Replacing a mirror "may" fix it, for a while (because it's clean an perfect) but isn't the answer.
Can probably be fixed with software patch to accept wider margins of expected operating conditions.

The mirror doesn't fully extend because the run duration of the motor is fixed but not long enough in all situations. It doesn't matter when the sequence starts w.r.t. other things going on with the car, and unfold executes fine, it just doesn't run the motor long enough. The unfolding sequence is timed with no hard limit feedback switch to inform the application (layer), so mirrors don't "know" if they're extended fully and software can't test that they are. Application software drives these motors brute force and is blind to actual position. It's possible there is some type of limiting switch for power cut-off. (Limiter could be a microswitch or a current sensing feature of the motor driver). These limiters are only being used to protect the hardware from damage.

So the application programmer just picked a reasonable amount of time that mirrors should be unfolded. I bet they set the timing of the motor based on observations in a perfectly clean warm lab on the bench... (not with units in a freezer set to -40C)... and added a bit more time to accommodate different environmental conditions. And so far have been mostly OK and lucky to match most environments. But not you!

Any situation where there's extra resistance will cause drag on the motor and slow down the spin.. but not stop it entirely. These are reasons for mirrors not fully extending:
- cold lubricant in the motor / mechanism, or hinge, or sliding surface
- insufficient lubricant on sliding surfaces, motor / mechanism, hinge
- resistance from obstacles: dirt, ice.. on any sliding surfaces. (Felt being trimmed is this.)

If any of these problems are sufficiently resistant to motion, a current limiting type switch on the motor driving would detect a stall and quit. This is to prevent stripping gears. Anybody accidentally unfold mirrors while parked close to a wall? It happens. If Tesla mirror is not using current sense on the motor, they'll need a gear-slip mechanism to prevent gear stripping for mid-travel blockage.

Anyway, it's just that timing is trimmed too tightly for the tolerances of the mirror assembly (its lube) and the environment it must operate in. Maybe Tesla set and never did adjust the timing from when they went from first to second to third generation of mirrors now on the car.

If Tesla is using current sensing, there's no harm driving these mirrors for an extra whole second in either direction. Mirror motors will cut out when they reach limits. This will be the software fix. The trick might be if some mirror vintages have and use different hardware features... one patch might not work for the fleet. Maybe SC will be able to do a "recalibration" for some but not others .. if you bring it in.
 
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Good explanation. I'm certain there must be some physical factor involved (e.g. dirt/ice/felt obstruction), not just software alone causing the problem -- aside from the general idea of non-robustly designed software tested only in a warm lab

Otherwise why would it only affect one mirror consistently. In my case, ignoring this last week of sub-freezing weather where both mirrors stuck for the first time in a year of ownership, it has only ever been the passenger mirror that doesn't fold out completely - and this happens intermittently in any season, not just the cold - so perhaps dirt or felt obstruction, poor lubrication etc.

btw, what do you think explains the "slack" that most of us seem to observe? It can't be direct-drive from the motor/gear, so I imagine the motor is driving a cam, or pulling a cable, etc. Anyone seen the actual mechanism involved in moving the mirrors? just curious
 
I had the same problem with the driver's side mirror in my S60, delivered in late August, 2016. The problem seemed to develop a few weeks after delivery and got slowly worse.

I made a service appointment, they replaced what they called the Mirror Assembly, and it has worked perfectly since.

Larry M

S60, Deep Blue Metallic, Pano, etc.
 
Ever since I got my car in 2013, my mirrors get stuck folding or unfolding all through the winter. Dirt and ice get in and slow them down. The service centre has cleaned them out and then they work for a while until they get dirty again. I use the workaround that others mentioned (hit button twice to fold/unfold the rest of the way) but I agree with scottm that a software solution is possible by just running the motors for longer. There will be times when that's not enough (e.g. mirror completely stuck from ice after a car wash) but it would solve the problem most times when they just need more time to fully fold or unfold.
 
I've had my S90D for only a week and it is been happening about half the time. I figured I'd wait a few weeks to see if it irons itself out or a software patch appears which fixes it. But then I'll call the service center to get it fixed.
 
Another possibility would be the motor timing is ample, but something else (mechanical) in the system is failing in similar conditions of cold, dirt, hard lubricant, path obstruction... maybe a slip clutch that is meant to protect the hardware pops then "sticks open" (because of stiff lubricant) actually disconnects too readily preventing the driving motor from doing useful work.

It would be telling to listen carefully to the mirror motor during a failed unfold process.

Key question is: Does the motor continue to make a driving sound for a bit after the mirror has stopped at a partially unfolded position. Or does the motor hush up at exactly that spot? (Indicative of current sensing stall detect).

If it continues to make a sound but changes pitch/tone/characteristic (going tick-tick-tick-..). then a clutch is continuing to slip for an enduring obstacle. Clean the path, thaw the ice, wipe the lube, whatever... If there's only one "tick" or "clunk" sound when the mirror stops and the motor continues to make basically a normal whirring sound for a duration after that, then a clutch could be sticking open, which points to internal drive lube issue.
 
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It would be telling to listen carefully to the mirror motor during a failed unfold process.

Key question is: Does the motor continue to make a driving sound for a bit after the mirror has stopped at a partially unfolded position. Or does the motor hush up at exactly that spot? (Indicative of current sensing stall detect).

If it continues to make a sound but changes pitch/tone/characteristic (going tick-tick-tick-..). then a clutch is continuing to slip for an enduring obstacle. Clean the path, thaw the ice, wipe the lube, whatever... If there's only one "tick" or "clunk" sound when the mirror stops and the motor continues to make basically a normal whirring sound for a duration after that, then a clutch could be sticking open, which points to internal drive lube issue.

I will try to listen more closely next time it happens (no telling when that will be, it's very intermittent, except in freezing conditions - but now this week it's above freezing here). I don't recall there being any telltale click or such at the point the right mirror stops, though there may be...

But as I mentioned, in my case even in warm weather when it happens, only the passenger mirror stops unfolding early. So at that same instant in time, the drivers mirror continues to move to its endpoint, so its motor sound is still continuing until the left mirror finishes. The issue of the "slack" in the partially extended mirror still seems odd ... and so, I was wondering if there something like a cable involved, binding in its housing. or as you say it could be some clutch slipping if there's some sort of obstruction

p.s. a friend who also has a Model S a few months newer than mine just told me he had this problem recently during a ski trip. Apparently the SC told him this is a "known issue" related to the cold and told him to try turning on the rear window/mirror defroster (still doesn't answer why the problem happens outside of winter!). And so I'm thinking to wait for warmer weather when it happens again before reporting it to the SC so it doesn't get brushed off as simply being related to ice
 
Ice can definitely make it stick, but it often gets stuck with just dirt (spray from slushy roads).

There's no clicking sound or change of pitch when it stops - the motors just run for a pre-set time and stop, even if the mirror hasn't completely folded or unfolded. There may be a slight variation in pitch because the motors are working a bit harder to overcome the drag of the dirt, but nothing that suggests a mechanical clutch or slipping gear.
 
hhmm, something is not jiving completely. This is a 2month old car, in california weather. So can't really blame the dirt/grime, ice, weather, salt etc.

I agree in general on the possibility of sub-optimized code running on the modules and not accounting for some of these normal wear & tear items...BTW, folding mirrors have been in production for 10s of yrs (my 10 yr old toyota had it from 2016). Prob new mechanism to do this more with software and running into timing/practical challenges...may need to put machine learning into this piece too - if after unfolding, the driver is using manual control or pushing the fold/unfold multiple times, do the same automatically...
 
Same here...Driver side mirror on P90D. I notice that the mirror when i get in car is 95% extended...sometimes 90% sometimes almost 100%...when I step on break to "turn on" the car...it extends out to 100%.

I suppose it could be software but have to have it go in for service anyway so will keep you all posted. Also have rubber along mirror falling off AND an odd soft knock that occurs when i switch from regen to light acceleration in a parking lot (under 7mph).....

car is 1 week old..LOL
 
My driver side mirror had this same issue the day I picked it up from the factory last week. When I helped it into place, the entire mirror fell off and was hanging by an electrical cable. Neither mirror positions down to view the tires in reverse. The mirrors were just one of the many assembly problems on my car. The gaps of the various lines of the car are all over the place, and discrepancy between the right and left side for respective lines (e.g., misalignment where the hatch meets the car, etc.). It looks like a drunk person put my car together. My guess is the factory is getting a little sloppy trying to make year-end numbers.
 
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Same problem here in Phoenix. Took delivery 12/17/16. Noticed today that driver's side mirror not expanding out fully or retracting in fully. Weather has been cold, for Phoenix (40 degrees). Service person scheduled to check it out tomorrow morning.