Setec CCS to Tesla Adapter

[mrc3]

I've just read all the comments on this thread.

Thank you for your warm greeting.

During a charging session, a Tesla requests voltage and current.
Ms/x requests up to its max current: its max current is modified to 200A by FW to protect the adapter.
M3 requests up to 126A. It never requests its real max current beyond 126A. The value is the same as that from Chadomo adapter.
From this, you can know M3 limits the current when it is charged via an adapter.
No vendor ID is sent in the protocol.
If it is permitted to upload exe files here, I will upload them here.

So presumably a Tesla supercharger ignores the 126A requested and supplies (or forces) something higher? Have you been able to examine the handshake with Tesla supercharge to see how it differs and can charge at greater than 100kw with a M3?

Thanks again,
Mike

 

[cwerdna]

Thanks for the reply! I did watch the video in advance, fortunately. I did ccs, then tesla, then turned the power on. The screen showed connecting to car, then the payment screen. I swiped a card, it said approved, then charging started it started making noise. then pretty quickly a charging failed message. then unplugged everything, powered off adapter and tried again a few times.

this is the one i used. tried 2 different machines. PlugShare - Find Electric Vehicle Charging Locations Near You yes, i felt like an idiot standing right across from the tesla chargers

Well, at least it has an excellent Plugshare score and there was a supposedly successful CCS charge on 12/28 by an Ioniq EV.

Nobody took pics of the labels but looks like BTCPower to me.

 

[chronoreverse]

I've heard that even native CCS cars often have problems with EA's chargers. It's really too bad they can't get their act together.

 

[ericj5]

Well, at least it has an excellent Plugshare score and there was a supposedly successful CCS charge on 12/28 by an Ioniq EV.

Nobody took pics of the labels but looks like BTCPower to me.

Whoops, will try to get pics next time. I didn’t see a brand/model on it, didn’t know where to look. but it looked like this btcpower to me too

 

[Randy Sinn]

So presumably a Tesla supercharger ignores the 126A requested and supplies (or forces) something higher? Have you been able to examine the handshake with Tesla supercharge to see how it differs and can charge at greater than 100kw with a M3?

Thanks again,
Mike

When you charge at a supercharger, "수퍼차저 충전중" (Supercharging) will be displayed on the screen. When you charge with an adapter, "충전중"(Charging) will be displayed. That means a vehicle knows which is plugged in.
The first message in the communication comes from a charger.
I guess that at the first message, Model 3 knows "Oh, you are a supercharger. Then you can send max current to me."
To examine the handshake with supercharger, I need a special device. So I haven't yet.

 

[cwerdna]

Randy Sinn: Not sure if you've been able to keep up with this entire thread but at Setec CCS to Tesla Adapter, I alluded to at least 8 DC FC CCS manufacturers w/equipment in the US.

Electrify America uses ABB, BTC Power, Signet and Efacec. Then there's Tritium (some branded ChargePoint). ChargePoint has some Tritium (CPE200), what appears to be ChargePoint's own (e.g. CPE250) own and IES (CPE100). You can see those by searching Everything You Need to Know About ChargePoint Stations | ChargePoint for those models.

Some BMW/Bosch units are the IES ones just like the CPE100. Harley Davidson dealers install those 24 kW IESunits too. Then there a Bosch 25 kW units that come from Delta (Taiwanese company). Chevy dealers might have IES units or GM/Chevy-branded Delta units.

I can't speak to all of EVgo, but the DC FCs I've used with them are BTC Power. But, they do have some from ABB (e.g. PlugShare - Find Electric Vehicle Charging Locations Near You, PlugShare - Find Electric Vehicle Charging Locations Near You and PlugShare - Find Electric Vehicle Charging Locations Near You).

If I missed any Combo1 DC FC manufacturers with equipment in the US, please chime in.

I know in Canada there is Flo SmartDC, but I've never seen any in the US.

I have 0 idea how many CCS1 DC FC vendors are present in South Korea and how many different models tend to be deployed of each. I'm guessing you'd have Signet, at minimum.

 

[mrc3]

When you charge at a supercharger, "수퍼차저 충전중" (Supercharging) will be displayed on the screen. When you charge with an adapter, "충전중"(Charging) will be displayed. That means a vehicle knows which is plugged in.
The first message in the communication comes from a charger.
I guess that at the first message, Model 3 knows "Oh, you are a supercharger. Then you can send max current to me."
To examine the handshake with supercharger, I need a special device. So I haven't yet.

Ahh, that is sort of what I was referring to with the handshake vender ID.... so the Car knows it is talking to a supercharger. So ANY aftermarket DC charger is going to face the same 50KW limitation unless they convince the car they are a super charger, or force higher current levels than the car advertises as being allowed.

Thanks for the information Randy.

Kind of disappointed in Tesla (but cynically not surprised) .

Mike

 

[chinney]

Ahh, that is sort of what I was referring to with the handshake vender ID.... so the Car knows it is talking to a supercharger. So ANY aftermarket DC charger is going to face the same 50KW limitation unless they convince the car they are a super charger, or force higher current levels than the car advertises as being allowed.

Thanks for the information Randy.

Kind of disappointed in Tesla (but cynically not surprised) .

Mike

Could this be a legitimate Tesla safety measure in working with non-Tesla chargers together with an adapter?

 

[mrc3]

Could this be a legitimate Tesla safety measure in working with non-Tesla chargers together with an adapter?

Well... possibly, I discounted that for two reasons:
1) It is allowed with model S/X with the same adapter.
2) Once the actual charging is started (after negotiations on what voltage/current/etc are decided upon)... it is actually pretty simple stuff outside the car. The car just see a high DC voltage source which it can suck a large number of amp of current from. Any concerns are outside of the car and hold true for whatever car the charger is connected to (including a tesla supercharger).

I could be wrong, and I expect if there is spin to take place, it will be along the lines of "safety" concerns

Mike

 

[pb2000]

Ahh, that is sort of what I was referring to with the handshake vender ID.... so the Car knows it is talking to a supercharger. So ANY aftermarket DC charger is going to face the same 50KW limitation unless they convince the car they are a super charger, or force higher current levels than the car advertises as being allowed.

Thanks for the information Randy.

Kind of disappointed in Tesla (but cynically not surprised) .

Mike

This is a bit of speculation, but with how common slow charging rates are on new superchargers in the first few days of operation, I wonder if Tesla's have a periodically updated GPS database (either separate from or connected to the nav) that is checked against the current location of the car. If that was the case, even spoofing the supercharger protocol wouldn't help.

 

[mrc3]

This is a bit of speculation, but with how common slow charging rates are on new superchargers in the first few days of operation, I wonder if Tesla's have a periodically updated GPS database (either separate from or connected to the nav) that is checked against the current location of the car. If that was the case, even spoofing the supercharger protocol wouldn't help.

Interesting theory, and quite possible

Mike

 

[Boeingpilot]

For what it’s worth I finally tried mine with an EA charger today and couldn’t get it going. Will reach out to support and keep trying for a bit

People, please include your car model when you report success or failure

thx

 

[Forty_Too]

Hi all. Just found this thread. I’ve tried mine on two so far - one Electrify America and one EVGo. Both failures sadly.

These two locations:
PlugShare - Find Electric Vehicle Charging Locations Near You
PlugShare - Find Electric Vehicle Charging Locations Near You

It seems my adapter also isn’t being recognized when I plug it into my computer - did you guys have to do anything special to get it to show up as a COM? I’ve tried two different computers and multiple cables now.

Model Y.

 

[Reddy_KW]

TheOk folks, here’s what data I have on first day of testing.

I have a 2019 Tesla Model 3 Long Range Dual Motor.

I had two ccs stations available to me to test. One was a 50 kW Efacec unit at my workplace; the other was a 150 kW Electrify America dispenser. The EA charger is a Gen 1 Signet Unit.

I had no success with the Efacec Unit at work. I was able to successfully charge at Electrify America.

Efacec Error Message and Nameplate Data:

Electrify America Gen 1 Signet Unit:

Tom Moloughney was right about those cables being a bear to handle. You really have to take care and drape those cables correctly to avoid putting torsion on the charge port.

Overall I’m glad it works and happy to have more options than Chademo. Just wish it want limited to 50 kW. I started at a 19% state of charge and never got above 46 kW.

Looking forward to more troubleshooting and firmware updates to see if the speed gets better.

Happy new year everyone!

 

[theothertom]

Thanks for all the hard work, guys. Following

 

[Webeevdrivers]

Thanks for all the hard work, guys. Following

mush, I second that. You guys are all troopers.

 

[C0ran]

Hi all. Just found this thread. I’ve tried mine on two so far - one Electrify America and one EVGo. Both failures sadly.

These two locations:
PlugShare - Find Electric Vehicle Charging Locations Near You
PlugShare - Find Electric Vehicle Charging Locations Near You

It seems my adapter also isn’t being recognized when I plug it into my computer - did you guys have to do anything special to get it to show up as a COM? I’ve tried two different computers and multiple cables now.

Model Y.

You need "CH341SER" USB Serial Driver.
Plz check my attachment.

1. Connect adapter with computer
2. Click install button, then you can see message "Driver install success"

 

[glebvk]

I am Randy from TKC(Tesla Korea Club), the guy who co-developed the SETEC's CCS1 adapter.


2. Model 3 has current limit by Tesla, not by the adapter. As you know, there is no other fast charging for Model 3 using an adapter than Chademo in the world. I guess that's why.
3. Model 3's limit can be lifted by FW update, but actually it is not lifted but "forced". So forced current could disrupt the system.
I have tested about 8 months with the curreent-forcing FW, but I had no problem. However, if you want to use the current-forcing FW, it should be totally on your risk. (I'll share it here if it is permitted.)

huge kudos on the adapter, opening the closeted teslas is very much welcome.

how does point 3 interact with charging speed that needs to taper down when higher SOC?

 

[RichAZ/CapeCod]

Very interesting information from the testers. Thanks!

Really really wish Tesla would come out of the closet on this one and sell us their charging interface unit.

Rich

 

[BritneySpears]

New firmware update from SETEC, version 2021.01.04: CCS Adapter Firmware Update | SETEC POWER