Two days with Model 3 impressions/review- This is not a mini model S

[JenniferQ]

I don't think it's a good idea to not be able to use the steering wheel to change speed and set distance in AP.

 

[dragoljub]

AIr suspension is definitely coming, but you couldn't pay me to take one of those. Personally could not care less about heated rear seats, I'll never be sitting back there. Unlimited supercharging… great, all of like five bucks a month savings for me Sunroof, heated steering wheel? Totally valid.

For my purposes I think the model 3 is a flat out better car. I know we all value different things in vehicles but I wouldn't take a brand new 100D over a Model 3 even if the 100D was at the Model 3's price. I spent 3 days with a Model S realllllly trying to convince myself to order one instead of continuing to wait for the 3 but there were too many things about it that I didn't like and I thought that the $34k difference between how I'd configure an S and how I'm configuring my 3 resulted in far too many downgrades and far too few improvements.

That said, if the Model 3 weren't coming I'd probably have bought the S and complained constantly about all the shortcomings, so you should probably all be happy that didn't happen

Hey another thread said that a software update will allow rear-seat heating to be turned on! So its just a rumor for now, maybe the steering wheel is also heated too. That would even further narrow the gap between Model 3 and Model S.

 

[David29]

I agree with what many have already expressed.

The Model 3 is a great car.

Immediate (not subtle) noticeable differences between either of our 2012 and 2013 Model S and Model 3 with 18" aeros.

1- Road Noise, even at 30mph, there is more road and/or tire noise throughout the cabin compared to our previous S's with air and 21" wheels.

I had my first ride in a Model 3 last night, as part of the cross-country tour being done by You You Xue. I was riding in the back seat. I would have said that the road noise and wind noise in the Model 3 was quite a bit less than in my Model S. I remember riding in the back seat of my Model S once or twice and especially noticing the road noise coming up through the wheel well right under or behind where I was sitting. It could be that we did not get up to a high enough speed to notice significant wind noise, as we were on an expressway, not a limited access highway, and top speed was roughly 52 mph. In any case, the car seemed pretty quiet to me.

3- Seats. They are definitely smaller as well as reasonably comfortable (still need more seat time) but a bit "foamy". I can't describe it, they feel soft yet hard at the same time. The middle back seat feels like there's something beneath the seat. I was sitting in the back center leaned forward and it felt uncomfortable while our Delivery specialist was going over the car.

I agree that the Model 3 rear seats did not feel comfortable. There was plenty of headroom, much more than in the S, but my knees were practically up in my face so that little if any of my thighs were on the seat, just my butt. And I had little space for my toes. It might have ben a little better if we did not have three large guys in the seat. That works but I would not want to be that crowded for long! Having said that, I also dislike the rear seat of the Model S and was distinctly uncomfortable the couple of times I was subjected to it (I can't imagine how people use them as taxis or limos without getting tons of complaints!).

 

[David29]

Total tangent, but all the talk about the reverse cam reminds me that a killer feature for me would be self-cleaning reverse cam. During winter/road salt season, I have to wipe it on a daily basis, sometimes multiple times a day, or it's worse than useless.

That reminds me of a bit of conversation we had at the Model 3 ride/drive event by You You Xue last night (which I mentioned above). I asked him about the complaints I had read that the rear window visibility was worse than Model S and possibly inadequate in some people's opinion. One of the Model 3 team said he was not bothered by the rear window and that he thought people really did not need it anyway. For reversing, he said to use the camera. Someone mentioned that it was (mostly or completely) unusable in rain or snow, and he said that you would just wipe the camera lens each time you stopped. Several of the New Englanders standing around in the 10F cold, with snow and road salt on the ground from the last storm and perhaps thinking ahead to the blizzard predicted for Thursday, commented that these California guys had a lot to learn about weather! The driver agreed that he had never driven in snow (but he was about to, as the team was headed into Canada).

 

[dragoljub]

I had my first ride in a Model 3 last night, as part of the cross-country tour being done by You You Xue. I was riding in the back seat. I would have said that the road noise and wind noise in the Model 3 was quite a bit less than in my Model S. I remember riding in the back seat of my Model S once or twice and especially noticing the road noise coming up through the wheel well right under or behind where I was sitting. It could be that we did not get up to a high enough speed to notice significant wind noise, as we were on an expressway, not a limited access highway, and top speed was roughly 52 mph. In any case, the car seemed pretty quiet to me.


I agree that the Model 3 rear seats did not feel comfortable. There was plenty of headroom, much more than in the S, but my knees were practically up in my face so that little if any of my thighs were on the seat, just my butt. And I had little space for my toes. It might have ben a little better if we did not have three large guys in the seat. That works but I would not want to be that crowded for long! Having said that, I also dislike the rear seat of the Model S and was distinctly uncomfortable the couple of times I was subjected to it (I can't imagine how people use them as taxis or limos without getting tons of complaints!).

In my back to back drives of 2017 S90D with 19-inch wheels with Air Suspension and 2017 Model 3 19 inch wheel with coil suspension on the freeway --> Model 3 has way more wind/tire/road noise then Model S (in drivers seat).

 

[David29]

By the way, to catch You You Xue's Model 3 on its North American round-trip tour, see his posts on Facebook. Last I heard he is heading across Canada towards Chicago, then will cross the northern US for a return to the west coast...

Tesla Model 3 Road Trip

 

[Stoneymonster]

I'm a little surprised by the number of posts hating on the Model S CID. I very much doubt I'd drop the mooted $2500 to get nothing but improved rez and more responsiveness, because I find the current rez and responsiveness adequate to the task. More than adequate, usually. I might part with $2500 to fix the software, notably the still-buggy-and-feature-poor-as-hell media player, but I would also be annoyed to spend that money on something that (a) is really a software problem and shouldn't require new hardware, and (b) should have been right to begin with.

Total tangent, but all the talk about the reverse cam reminds me that a killer feature for me would be self-cleaning reverse cam. During winter/road salt season, I have to wipe it on a daily basis, sometimes multiple times a day, or it's worse than useless.

It’s like updating your computer. Once you use a new fast one for a while, going back to the old one is always harder. Even if you were ok with it before.

@dragoljub Yup, it’s loud. Good thing we have the speed sensitive volume control, I guess!

 

[jerjozwik]

put 65 miles on the clock and i am now confident i love this car.

 

[T34ME]

That said, if the Model 3 weren't coming I'd probably have bought the S and complained constantly about all the shortcomings, so you should probably all be happy that didn't happen

Yes, but we can look forward to all your constant complaints about the shortcomings of the model 3!

 

[Stoneymonster]

Yes, but we can look forward to all your constant complaints about the shortcomings of the model 3!

It’s one foot shorter.

 

[MarkS22]

I'm a little surprised by the number of posts hating on the Model S CID. I very much doubt I'd drop the mooted $2500 to get nothing but improved rez and more responsiveness.

It's not just resolution and responsiveness. A faster processor would enable more features, some of which may not have been invented yet. Faster processors mean more advanced software options. For example, being able to stitch the cameras to create an overhead view of your surroundings in real-time. Or, a usable HD video player when you're parked and on Wi-Fi or sufficient Level of Autonomy. Or a web browser that's as responsive as a modern tablet. Faster, more accurate speech recognition. Patches can install faster. Maps with 3D renderings of buildings and geography. Or, let's take it to the next level: While Autopilot is engaged (perhaps at Level 3 or above), show the forward facing camera with an augmented reality highlighting cars or superimposing arrows on the real-time video of the exit you'll be taking.

What about adding higher frame rates to the instrument cluster and truly three-dimensional displays of the vehicles around you that rotate fluidly? Perhaps highlighting pedestrians in red. My point being, the current features aren't the only features it'll ever have. Software can only do so much with a Tegra 3. Resolution and screen quality would just be a natural upgrade as the screen package is updated.

There's no question it's adequate. But when you switch between an iPhone X to an iPad Pro or Surface to the Tesla interface, it's much more dramatic. Back in 2014, it was already starting to show some signs of slowdown. The browser was never truly adequate. The maps were slightly laggy. On a premium vehicle from "Silicon Valley," I expect more after six years.

I understand they have a lot on their plate. I'm not hating on it so much as I'm expressing a desire for an improvement in this area. And, as my lease end us coming up, I expressed this to Tesla as well. We all buy for different reasons. For me, cutting edge technology is high on the list.

 

[cwerdna]

Faster processors mean more advanced software options. For example, being able to stitch the cameras to create an overhead view of your surroundings in real-time.

My '13 Leaf w/premium package has that feature (Around View Monitor in Nissan parlance). It's 1 of the features of the premium package. Nissan's even offered it on cars as lowly as the Versa Note.

I doubt the CPU in the '13 Leaf's head unit is anywhere near as powerful as the one in a current Model S or even the '12 Model S, if they changed the CPU driving the MCU.

 

[CuriousG]

Yes, but we can look forward to all your constant complaints about the shortcomings of the model 3!

@run-the-joules just stated that "the model 3 is a flat out better car". Will someone with his depleted battery and VIN starved regime please inform him that I too have a Tesla, but is much bigger & more powerful one than his, and my Tesla works.

Before anyone gets their panties in a bunch, it's a play on a recent news tweet.

 

[voip-ninja]

It's not just resolution and responsiveness. A faster processor would enable more features, some of which may not have been invented yet. Faster processors mean more advanced software options. For example, being able to stitch the cameras to create an overhead view of your surroundings in real-time. Or, a usable HD video player when you're parked and on Wi-Fi or sufficient Level of Autonomy. Or a web browser that's as responsive as a modern tablet. Faster, more accurate speech recognition. Patches can install faster. Maps with 3D renderings of buildings and geography. Or, let's take it to the next level: While Autopilot is engaged (perhaps at Level 3 or above), show the forward facing camera with an augmented reality highlighting cars or superimposing arrows on the real-time video of the exit you'll be taking.

What about adding higher frame rates to the instrument cluster and truly three-dimensional displays of the vehicles around you that rotate fluidly? Perhaps highlighting pedestrians in red. My point being, the current features aren't the only features it'll ever have. Software can only do so much with a Tegra 3. Resolution and screen quality would just be a natural upgrade as the screen package is updated.

There's no question it's adequate. But when you switch between an iPhone X to an iPad Pro or Surface to the Tesla interface, it's much more dramatic. Back in 2014, it was already starting to show some signs of slowdown. The browser was never truly adequate. The maps were slightly laggy. On a premium vehicle from "Silicon Valley," I expect more after six years.

I understand they have a lot on their plate. I'm not hating on it so much as I'm expressing a desire for an improvement in this area. And, as my lease end us coming up, I expressed this to Tesla as well. We all buy for different reasons. For me, cutting edge technology is high on the list.

"Surround view" requires down pointing cameras for the side views (they are in the mirrors and point straight down) and as far as I know it's a patented feature which is why only some automakers offer it. Musk has been bugged repeatedly about why the fancy Model S does not have this feature and he's never responded.

 

[T34ME]

@run-the-joules just stated that "the model 3 is a flat out better car". Will someone with his depleted battery and VIN starved regime please inform him that I too have a Tesla, but is much bigger & more powerful one than his, and my Tesla works.

But I still say you both have ugly hair and the small model 3 steering is too big for your small hands! Just for the record, my hair isn't ugly because I don't have any and my hands are useless because of.............arthritis. That's why I need Full Self Driving!

 

[ForeverFree]

In my back to back drives of 2017 S90D with 19-inch wheels with Air Suspension and 2017 Model 3 19 inch wheel with coil suspension on the freeway --> Model 3 has way more wind/tire/road noise then Model S (in drivers seat).

We have an S and a 3, and I would second that.

Everything else about the car is so impressive that I am thinking about using my second reservation/invite to downsize from S85D to 3LR AWD when that becomes available. My two biggest reservations? Road noise. And uncertainty about frontal collision safety (way less car in front of you) ... pending testing results.

 

[MarkS22]

"Surround view" requires down pointing cameras for the side views (they are in the mirrors and point straight down) and as far as I know it's a patented feature which is why only some automakers offer it. Musk has been bugged repeatedly about why the fancy Model S does not have this feature and he's never responded.

Yes, I understand how it works. I've had it in several other vehicles (like an Infiniti), but there are alternatives. BMW offers a stitched surround view that's more at eye level. I haven't seen what the FOV looks like on all the side cameras, but there's a chance a wide angle lens would capture useful information for situational awareness. It doesn't have to be "birds eye." Even stitching three rear cameras while backing up could be nice. I was just tossing out examples of how more processing power could be used.

 

[cwerdna]

I always thought most modern cars are like the Model 3. My last 2 BMW’s don’t lock the stalk up or down. I’m pretty sure my wife’s Acura is the same. In the BMW you can either push the stalk up or down to cancel a signal. It’s always seemed easy enough to me. For some reason I just assumed that all cars that have the soft 3 blink position don’t lock the stalk in the full position. I guess I don’t drive enough different cars.

I'm haven't driven the 3, but I'm guessing it's strange to anyone not used to BMWs and/or Minis (BMW has owned them for awhile). (raises hand as I'm not a BMW guy)

What you describe about your BMWs seems to be a BMW-(and Mini-)only thing which they switched to years ago. I've never driven any other cars with that goofy turn signal.

Not sure what your timeframe of "modern" is, but my '13 Leaf has the traditional lock stalk up/down until you turn the steering wheel a certain amount. I'm pretty sure this was the case on the pre-production '18 Leaf I drove almost a month ago. I can't think of any non-BMW and non-Mini cars that I've rented or test driven in the past 5 years that has the goofy BMW/Mini behavior. I'll probably be test driving a few new cars at an auto show in a few days.

Ok. I was the Silicon Valley Auto Show today. I only test drove a few vehicles (Chrysler Pacifica minivan PHEV, Fiat 124 Spyder, Toyota Mirai, Chevy Bolt and gen 2 Volt) but sat in many others.

Out of all the new vehicles I was in where I played w/the turn signal lever, every single one I recall had the traditional turn signal lever design. The only one I remember with the unusual BMW/Mini-like design/behavior was a Lexus RC 350. Even other Lexuses didn't seem to have this nor did any Toyotas.

I forgot to try the Model 3, but I'll trust what others say here about that. (Was surprised to find a Model 3 there and opened up for anyone to sit in and play w/the controls and touchscreen as Tesla usually never shows up at auto shows.)

 

[jerjozwik]

whats more annoying is the model S has locking blinker stalks, and the 3 does not. driving the model s for two years now i have gotten used to what to expect, now its all different with the 3. easy enough to get used to... but it is also easy enough to drive a mile with the blinker on when you think it was off...

 

[MSR]

Here are a few features they S and X have, that "the 3 doesn't and possibly won't ever have."

Hatchback
72 Amp charger
Panoramic windscreen (X)
Auto open and close front doors (X)
Falcon wing rear doors (X)
two screens
Bio-defense HEPA air filter
Free supercharging
Heated steering wheel and windshield wipers
High res backup camera

However, the 3 has the advantages listed in earlier posts. I think I am going to like it more than my S.

GSP

The Model 3 is an great EV with some interior improvements over the S and X, but there are at least four other significant features the S and X have that are missing from the Model 3:

• An awesome dashboard (2nd display) with configurable apps to the left and right of the center autopilot display
• Local GPS maps that make navigation possible without a cellular signal
• 8-year unlimited mileage warranty on BOTH the battery and "drive unit" (the Model 3's is limited to 125K miles [with the larger battery; 100K wo] and does not cover the "drive unit"]
• Powered liftgate vs. manual truck for the Model 3