FSD Beta v11.x

kriskros91 · Mar 28, 2023

I wonder if Tesla is going to continue to improve the messaging displayed on the screen regarding it's actions. One thing I just thought of regarding UPL or UPR would be to say "car turning after car approaching from (right) or (left) passes". That would be amazing and would instill so much confidence and help with planning. Rather than guessing what the car will do. I think Chuck would be more at ease with his turns if this was done.

I just saw a video by Farzad Mesbahi on his 11.3.3 drive and the car tried to do a UPL and it was obviously too late and too slow leading to almost an emergency disengagement. I think if he had a message saying beforehand that the car was going for it he could have disengaged it prior to a dangerous situation happening.

sleepydoc · Mar 28, 2023

Supcom said:
FSDb has never recognized a school bus as anything special.

Yes - this is a known issue that’s been present in all versions.

sleepydoc · Mar 28, 2023

kriskros91 said:
I wonder if Tesla is going to continue to improve the messaging displayed on the screen regarding it's actions. One thing I just thought of regarding UPL or UPR would be to say "car turning after car approaching from (right) or (left) passes". That would be amazing and would instill so much confidence and help with planning. Rather than guessing what the car will do. I think Chuck would be more at ease with his turns if this was done.

I just saw a video by Farzad Mesbahi on his 11.3.3 drive and the car tried to do a UPL and it was obviously too late and too slow leading to almost an emergency disengagement. I think if he had a message saying beforehand that the car was going for it he could have disengaged it prior to a dangerous situation happening.

On one hand, messaging would be good. On the other hand my eyes are on the road in these situations so I probably wouldn’t see the message anyway.

Ramphex · Mar 28, 2023

sleepydoc said:
On one hand, messaging would be good. On the other hand my eyes are on the road in these situations so I probably wouldn’t see the message anyway.

I love how dedicated you are to watching the road! You’re my favorite person from Minneapolis!

kriskros91 · Mar 28, 2023

sleepydoc said:
On one hand, messaging would be good. On the other hand my eyes are on the road in these situations so I probably wouldn’t see the message anyway.

That's a good point. I think there's sometimes a bit of a pause when I think the car will try to make a turn and it surprises me when it doesn't or when I think it won't go and it tries to make it. I think if I know that a message will always appear I could quickly glance down and check if it will go when I think it will and that could help me brace for the actual turn.

Another thing I thought of is that the car still does the turn blinker on while waiting to change lanes and then turns it off if it doesn't find a space it likes right away and then turns it back on and then off and on. Humans don't do that. They just keep the blinker on and message to others that they want to change lanes and wait until the lane change is done.

sleepydoc · Mar 28, 2023

kriskros91 said:
That's a good point. I think there's sometimes a bit of a pause when I think the car will try to make a turn and it surprises me when it doesn't or when I think it won't go and it tries to make it. I think if I know that a message will always appear I could quickly glance down and check if it will go when I think it will and that could help me brace for the actual turn.

Another thing I thought of is that the car still does the turn blinker on while waiting to change lanes and then turns it off if it doesn't find a space it likes right away and then turns it back on and then off and on. Humans don't do that. They just keep the blinker on and message to others that they want to change lanes and wait until the lane change is done.

I do look down at the display when it’s approaching some turn lanes and I’m watching to see which lane the car will take, but only if there aren’t any other cars/VRUs or other potential accidents around.

diplomat33 · Mar 28, 2023

I got V11.3.3 yesterday. I noticed it did fix one little issue. On the previous version of FSD beta, my car would turn on the turn signal for about 1 second and phantom brake just a little every time I passed this building on US40 as if the car briefly thought maybe it was supposed to turn into that building area. It was weird since the planner would show the car going straight. But V11.3.3 fixed the behavior. The car no longer turns on the turn signal or phantom brakes anymore when it passes this building on US40.

arghx7 · Mar 28, 2023

I've had 11.3.3 a few days now (coming from 10.69.x) . I'd say overall the big issue I'm having are wonky turns and lane changes. I had the car in the left lane (2 lane + right turning lane) cross two lanes to pass a car on the right in the right turning lane which was ending. That was pretty scary. Then today coming off the highway, the car needed to be in the left two turning lanes, but crossed one lane too far to the right while turning in the intersection. Overall safety is worse I'd say. It feels like a rush job to deploy by the end of the quarter (for financial or regulatory reasons). The new traffic sign behavior is annoying but hey if that's what NHTSA wants there's nothing they can do.

I do like the new visualizations.

Hayseed_MS · Mar 28, 2023

Ramphex said:
I actually want the FSD to prove me wrong. That creates the excitement. The day it can use the brakes, or preferably regen, to stop without making me spill my coffee, is the day I’ll be excited.

Your FSD...

Ramphex · Mar 28, 2023

Hayseed_MS said:
Your FSD...

I think it would need to be a straw to prevent any spillage. But then I might end up deep throating the straw…. Not really sure how to solve this other than just if it would brake like any normal person would lol

JB47394 · Mar 28, 2023

sleepydoc said:
On one hand, messaging would be good. On the other hand my eyes are on the road in these situations so I probably wouldn’t see the message anyway.

While we're still beta testing the thing, voice announcements would be nice, as with the navigation system. Mostly just "proceeding", "stopping", "turning left", "turning right", "changing lane left", "changing lane right", "freaking out". Stuff like that.

Ramphex · Mar 28, 2023

JB47394 said:
While we're still beta testing the thing, voice announcements would be nice, as with the navigation system. Mostly just "proceeding", "stopping", "turning left", "turning right", "changing lane left", "changing lane right", "freaking out". Stuff like that.

Only with a toggle to turn that crap off.

AlanSubie4Life · Mar 28, 2023

JB47394 said:
While we're still beta testing the thing, voice announcements would be nice, as with the navigation system. Mostly just "proceeding", "stopping", "turning left", "turning right", "changing lane left", "changing lane right", "freaking out". Stuff like that.

The best thing they can do is adjust the driving to make it obvious what is happening. When a human is driving, as a passenger, you can usually tell what is going on.

But when FSD deviates from that natural behavior, it is confusing and results in disengagements (and lack of or late dangerous disengagements where there should be ones).

Has to do with timing of actions, acceleration, and the jerk. Correctly timed steering wheel movement, vehicle posture. And of course signaling, movement in lanes, etc.

A super easy task for a competent human who is attentive to passenger comfort.

Some people suggest that version 11 improved on this. We’ll see. One more point release end of week it seems - presumably working through the pareto.

kabin · Mar 28, 2023

kriskros91 said:
I wonder if Tesla is going to continue to improve the messaging displayed on the screen regarding it's actions. One thing I just thought of regarding UPL or UPR would be to say "car turning after car approaching from (right) or (left) passes". That would be amazing and would instill so much confidence and help with planning. Rather than guessing what the car will do. I think Chuck would be more at ease with his turns if this was done.

I just saw a video by Farzad Mesbahi on his 11.3.3 drive and the car tried to do a UPL and it was obviously too late and too slow leading to almost an emergency disengagement. I think if he had a message saying beforehand that the car was going for it he could have disengaged it prior to a dangerous situation happening.

I'd love to see more inner workings of path decision making but I suspect it wouldn't be confidence inspiring if the messages are as bipolar as the blue path frequently indicates.

Although path for V11.3.3 is slightly improved it remains a poor performer as demonstrated by wonky turns, lane selection, roundabouts, ....

kabin · Mar 28, 2023

I had a freaky experience after a right turn at an intersection. The steering began swerving wildy right and left related to a small bus turn out lane. Path was acting bipolar as it tried to figure out how to handle the extra lane that wasn't there a split second ago. The lane was only ~1.5 bus lengths long so it's clear to the casual observer where to drive.

kabin · Mar 28, 2023

arghx7 said:
I've had 11.3.3 a few days now (coming from 10.69.x) . I'd say overall the big issue I'm having are wonky turns and lane changes. I had the car in the left lane (2 lane + right turning lane) cross two lanes to pass a car on the right in the right turning lane which was ending. That was pretty scary. Then today coming off the highway, the car needed to be in the left two turning lanes, but crossed one lane too far to the right while turning in the intersection. Overall safety is worse I'd say. It feels like a rush job to deploy by the end of the quarter (for financial or regulatory reasons). The new traffic sign behavior is annoying but hey if that's what NHTSA wants there's nothing they can do.

I do like the new visualizations.

I agree with the idea of Elon wanting an end of quarter feather in the cap.

vanca · Mar 28, 2023

JB47394 said:
While we're still beta testing the thing, voice announcements would be nice, as with the navigation system. Mostly just "proceeding", "stopping", "turning left", "turning right", "changing lane left", "changing lane right", "freaking out". Stuff like that.

It's great that you can talk to the car to set most options while driving (instead of fiddling with menus on the screen). I'm always surprised that you can't set the car to vocalize back announcements, but are required to read text on the screen instead.

n.one.one · Mar 28, 2023

Ramphex said:
I love how dedicated you are to watching the road! You’re my favorite person from Minneapolis!

Hey @Ramphex, are you on a goodwill tour. Did you hire a public relations team. Good stuff.

Ramphex · Mar 28, 2023

n.one.one said:
Hey @Ramphex, are you on a goodwill tour. Did you hire a public relations team. Good stuff.

Today is Opposite Tuesday inside my head

Dewg · Mar 28, 2023

n.one.one said:
Hey @Ramphex, are you on a goodwill tour. Did you hire a public relations team. Good stuff.

At some point we have to start checking for a stroke - something about burnt toast?

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