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Wiki MASTER THREAD: Actual FSD Beta downloads and experiences

Finally got into the beta…

…By unintentionally abusing the hell out of the process.


I had been routinely getting 98s and 99s, but my commute is just not friendly with Tesla’s description of close following distances, so there were a few 93s and 95s scattered in, dragging my average down. I had reset a few times, and was honestly considering saying “screw it” and moving on with my life, but had reset for one last try. Got a 99. Got a 100. Let the better half drive the night of the 29th, and was sure she got a low ninety-something, and kinda wrote off the whole thing in my head. Parked the car for the night, and slept in on my day off.

What I hadn’t realized was that she had scored a 99, and the car had been parked with exactly 101 combined miles since the last reset. I got the notification that 2021.36.8.8 was ready for download around 2pm on the 30th, completely out of the blue.

You too can be astonishingly lucky and receive unfinished beta software!
 
Question # 1: does the individual system in the car "learn", or is the system only receiving and reporting information to/from the servers in Fremont? Question #2: over time with either the car "learning", or the servers updating, will these slight annoyances go away?
Your car is not "learning" in such a way that it will drive differently than my car. Tesla picks up some data as you drive, sends it to homebase when you're parked over Wi-Fi, pulls the data into their data pipeline, and future software updates make your car "learn". (Tesla can change things between software updates, but in theory nothing too drastic. E.g. 10.3 had some AEB issues and I believe they disabled AEB until they did a rollback and patch over the air.) I think a combination of Tesla getting data about FSD beta driving and them tweaking various hyperparameters and NN structure has been / will be making annoyances go away.

PS - an interesting and unrelated point: the 10.5 download occurred in my car without any WiFi connection - is this a characteristic of FSD updates?
Yeah it seems to be. Tesla has pushed out updates over LTE before (and I think they'll push one out if your car falls really behind on updates), but it seems that they're pretty consistently pushing the FSD beta updates out over LTE.

…By unintentionally abusing the hell out of the process.
Yesssss 😎. Congrats!
 
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I agree with your assessment. The majority of my drives are zero disengagement and many I don't even have to intervene goosing up the speed. I think this has a lot to do with the environments where people are driving. I observe excellent behavior interacting with static objects (intersections, turns, traffic lights, etc.) and generally very good behavior dealing with traffic as long as it is somewhat orderly. Interestingly, it handles some very complicated 5- and 6-way intersections, some of which the streets don't actually line up, flawlessly.

View attachment 740124
Nice! I've been fairly impressed with the beta handling some unruly intersections (while being realistic there are too many situations that it'll never be able to be handle anytime soon). I have this particularly complex area near my house called Loyola Corners that I drive though frequently, where the road intersects seven different residential streets within a one block radius, plus on/off ramps for a major expressway. There is also frequently bike and pedestrian traffic at the same time. It hesitates a bit, so but so far it has sailed through the area like a champ, though I've not tried all the myriad routes through it....

LoyolaCorners.png
 

RowdyMY

Member
Jun 21, 2021
149
314
Raleigh
On two Lane divided highways (eg 301 in southern MD and 1 in NC) that were previously not considered limited access for NoA purposes my car is He🏒🏒 bent on changing into the left lane, even without traffic.

The notice is "changing lanes into the faster lane". My speed limit is relative at +8% so this often happens when traffic will be overtaking soon.

Anyone else? I bump that lane change off ~ every 30" when it decides that's the best COA before I usually just ended up disengaging the thing.

MY. 10.5.
 
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I passed "Elon's driving test" with a 99 and got the 10.5 version early this week in my 2020 MSLR.

A couple of observations and a question.

Observation #1: the dash graphics are really cool - I can see them being useful under some visibility conditions to keep you aware of stuff on (and adjacent) to the road. Observation #2: the system seems to be afraid of shadows and driveways - I get brake applications that seem to be related to either vivid tree shadows or empty driveways.

Question # 1: does the individual system in the car "learn", or is the system only receiving and reporting information to/from the servers in Fremont? Question #2: over time with either the car "learning", or the servers updating, will these slight annoyances go away?

Thanks!

PS - an interesting and unrelated point: the 10.5 download occurred in my car without any WiFi connection - is this a characteristic of FSD updates?
The shadows are a real problem for me and many others have reported the same issue. Morning and late afternoon are the worst. Once while driving home I was going east and the sun was setting behind me, the only shadow on the road was from the car, it kept stopping because it saw its own shadow.
 
I'm looking forward to 10.6 for sure. 10.5 for me has been an improvement. Incremental for sure, but still an improvement. It's been more consistent in traffic circles, not great yet but it hasn't tried to crash in any circles. Right turns seem less likely to curb the wheels and left turns are getting better too. It mostly gives better spacing on parked cars in neighborhoods. I haven't had any big phantom braking, more just phantom slowing down. My single biggest gripe is how long it takes to slow down after passing a reduced speed limit sign. It takes a full block or more, enough to get a ticket if you don't intervene. I can't figure out how when just on Cruise Control it can stop at stop signs perfectly, but engage FSD and it all goes to hell? Also, it really needs to have different speed offsets for different speed limits. 35 and above a set percentage above is fine, but you should be able to have a negative offset for neighborhoods. 25 is just too fast in all of the neighborhoods around here. 22 is far more reasonable. I'd like to be able to set 22 in a 25, 30 in a 30, 40 in a 35, 50 in a 45 and +9 for speed limits 55 and above.

I really love Beta if I just intervene for all turns. It does a better job than our 3 on winding roads, I like the elimination of the +5 for speed, and stopping and proceeding through traffic signals is great.
 
So after a few frustrating weeks of trying to get beta I got pissed and just gave up.

After a couple weeks of calming down and reading about the 100 mile requirement, I got back into the game with a plan. I basically went out on a Sunday highway cruise, on autopilot, and racked up over 100 miles. I originally planned it for Saturday night, but a wreck on the highway squashed that plan. I did put some 17 miles in on Saturday night, however. I didn't drive on Monday and by Tuesday afternoon I had Beta!!!

If you would like more info -

Please let me know how long it took you to get beta and/or if you have heard of anyone getting it this quickly.
 
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S4WRXTTCS

Well-Known Member
May 3, 2015
6,029
7,286
Snohomish, WA
So, my question again is whether some folks are unhappy with anything short of perfection, and would rather complain than take corrective action when needed. Or are some cars more prone to difficulties? That's not impossible.

A lot of the issues with FSD/NoA are maps related, and the difference in where people are driving accounts for a lot of the variabilities.

Like I can't have a zero intervention drive to work because Navigation issues prevents that.

Another thing that impacts FSD/NoA is a persons willingness to look like an idiot. If you're someone who's really self conscious you'll likely going to take over much sooner than someone who just doesn't care. A lot of the FSD Beta testers are basically exhibitionist showing the world their idiocy, but they test it in ways that I simply wouldn't so there is a benefit to the community in seeing what happens when a person allows FSD beta to do its thing.

There does seem to be a lot of variability within the HW itself, and this is something Tesla really needs to address. One of the early FSD Beta testers had some bad behavior that didn't seem to match up with other vehicles with the FSD beta, and Tesla fixed something.

One day I got so irked at FSD Beta and so I ran the camera calibration routine and that fixed some of what I was irked by. But, it could have just been a happenstance kind of thing.

FSD Beta from 10.3 to the current 10.5 has really sucked on my car, and I don't know why. I won't really know if anything is wrong with my car until the rolling average for FSD Beta in my area says its pretty darn good. Right now the rolling average for my area is mostly problematic. So its hard to know if there is something wrong when there is so much wrong to begin with.

I do know that some FSD Beta testers are deeply religious about cleaning their cameras so this might account for some of it.

Weather is a contributing factor. Most of my hate for Pure Vision is due to how sucky it can be in the rain in the PNW. Even to the point of slowing down while in TACC only.

For myself personally I'm probably more demanding than others so for me FSD Beta is constantly telling it "No, don't do that". I also have 20" rims on a Performance Model 3 so I'm pretty protective of those. If my FSD Beta vehicle was a CyberTruck I'd have way less interventions.
 
This evening I had a terrible run with 10.5 in downtown Burlingame CA. Haven’t had it this bad for a while. While most errors were bad planning or reacting to false positives (phantom braking or evasion) that might cause troubles for myself and drivers around me, one of them posed serious danger. Here is a video shot:
Tesla tried to make a left turn in the left turn lane, there was a fire truck behind me on the right lane. When executing the turn, maybe because of the pylons on the divider, the car swirled into the right lane before making the left. Even I disengaged immediately and made turn myself, as you can see from the video the car was already in the right lane, and the fire truck honked me super angry while moved into the shoulder. The lanes here are narrow and if there were bicycles or obstacles on the shoulder, the truck would hit me.

The beta seriously need to stop doing this in the turn. However my biggest fear is this is due to the low voxel resolution in the 3D reconstruction, therefore it actually cannot make precise decision and have to leave bigger margin than necessary (swirl before turn to avoid divider or curbs)
 
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TIppy

Active Member
Jul 8, 2016
1,914
1,718
Tampa, FL
This evening I had a terrible run with 10.5 in downtown Burlingame CA. Haven’t had it this bad for a while. While most errors were bad planning or reacting to false positives (phantom braking or evasion) that might cause troubles for myself and drivers around me, one of them posed serious danger. Here is a video shot:
Tesla tried to make a left turn in the left turn lane, there was a fire truck behind me on the right lane. When executing the turn, maybe because of the pylons on the divider, the car swirled into the right lane before making the left. Even I disengaged immediately and made turn myself, as you can see from the video the car was already in the right lane, and the fire truck honked me super angry while moved into the shoulder. The lanes here are narrow and if there were bicycles or obstacles on the shoulder, the truck would hit me.

The beta seriously need to stop doing this in the turn. However my biggest fear is this is due to the low voxel resolution in the 3D reconstruction, therefore it actually cannot make precise decision and have to leave bigger margin than necessary (swirl before turn to avoid divider or curbs)
Aren't you required to move to the edge of the road and stop for emergency vehicles in California?
 
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JulienW

Active Member
Jul 7, 2018
3,166
4,198
Atlanta
Who else is ready for FSD Beta to be able to drive in reverse? So many use cases for this!
Sounds GREAT on paper. However this is going to be HUGE change for how he perceive and monitor. What if the car "does the wrong thing at the worst time" and starts reversing when you are mentally "all in" for forward movement. This will cause a slight delay in your response time since you must first process that the car is going backwards instead of forward. We have all suffered this confusion before like sitting at a red light looking down and when we look up the cars on both sides of us are creeping forward at the same pace. We feel like we are rolling backwards up and will hit the brake pedal.

This must be implemented carefully with some type of distinct warning system.
 
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On two Lane divided highways (eg 301 in southern MD and 1 in NC) that were previously not considered limited access for NoA purposes my car is He🏒🏒 bent on changing into the left lane, even without traffic.

The notice is "changing lanes into the faster lane". My speed limit is relative at +8% so this often happens when traffic will be overtaking soon.

Anyone else? I bump that lane change off ~ every 30" when it decides that's the best COA before I usually just ended up disengaging the thing.

MY. 10.5.

I don't often drive on "in-between" roads like that, but this Sunday I was on US-64 around Asheboro, NC, and it was doing what you describe so much that I ended up going back to I-85, rather than continue on the scenic route.
 

TIppy

Active Member
Jul 8, 2016
1,914
1,718
Tampa, FL
Sounds GREAT on paper. However this is going to be HUGE change for how he perceive and monitor. What if the car "does the wrong thing at the worst time" and starts reversing when you are mentally "all in" for forward movement. This will cause a slight delay in your response time since you must first process that the car is going backwards instead of forward. We have all suffered this confusion before like sitting at a red light looking down and when we look up the cars on both sides of us are creeping forward at the same pace. We feel like we are backing up and will hit the brake pedal.
I think it was in this thread, but someone already reported that their car reversed after pulling out. The car indicated it was still in drive, so if you override with the accelerator the car would probably go forward.
 

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