As an AP1 owner who made a 1000 mile trip in an AP2 loaner, I can say that trying them in reverse produced the same conclusion. I loved the Model X loaner but AP2 made me want to leave it on the side of the road and Uber home. Granted this was back in early July, so I'll readily admit that today's AP2 is not the AP2 of early July...
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As an AP1 owner who made a 1000 mile trip in an AP2 loaner, I can say that trying them in reverse produced the same conclusion. I loved the Model X loaner but AP2 made me want to leave it on the side of the road and Uber home. Granted this was back in early July, so I'll readily admit that today's AP2 is not the AP2 of early July...
AP 2 since Sep here on .42. 4000 miles so far. Just coming off a 1000 mile round trip. 99 % autopilot.
I'm more than happy with where autopilot 2 is. Based on what I read AP 1 is better visually and had rain sensing wipers.
My recommendation is to enjoy AP 2.0
TaoJones
Beyond Driven
Well said. The perfect unicorn would be an AP1 car with a glass roof (as much as I do like the pano, I rarely use it) and the various interior and fit/finish improvements made over time since.
For all of the hullaballoo over *.44, it's still not close to AP1 especially off-highway.
And frankly, neither AP1 nor AP2 solve the truck lust or basic lane centering challenges of common-sense, dailyl driving. For example, if oncoming traffic on a 2-lane state route, I'd prefer if the car shift to the right - this would have saved at least one windshield rock chip. When passing a large truck or really any vehicle on the highway, I'd prefer that the car shift to the left. But no.
Am getting closer to finding an AP1 replacement for my AP2 car. When APx manages stop sign reaction, I'll consider going back to an APx car, presuming that some improvement has been made with the aforementioned use cases as well.
Tesla should not get beat by Audi, GM, Volvo, or any other manufacturer. Hopefully Elon and company (literally) pull a rabbit out of their nether regions and by this time next year, er, 2019, er, 2020, we'll all be happy campers. Soooo many signs point in that direction (system on a chip, camera testing, and so forth), but I'm going to have to see it working in the wild before parting with another chunk of change.
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Destiny1701
22’ M3LR ‘DrkNite’/ 22’ MYP BliueRocket
I came from an AP1 2016 Model to the .44 AP2 a few weeks back. I have to say the current AP2 is actually more stable than .42 (not as drunk).
Also AP1 would lose the lines at every single traffic intersection whereas the AP2 holds the lines blue and doesn’t waver
I drive both city of highway and so far I’ve felt the same level of confidence in AP2 as was with AP1.
Holds the lanes well and doesn’t waver much at all. I expected worst given all the comments about how inferior AP2 was. I do miss seeing vehicles in other lanes however
Also AP1 would lose the lines at every single traffic intersection whereas the AP2 holds the lines blue and doesn’t waver
I drive both city of highway and so far I’ve felt the same level of confidence in AP2 as was with AP1.
Holds the lanes well and doesn’t waver much at all. I expected worst given all the comments about how inferior AP2 was. I do miss seeing vehicles in other lanes however
I took .44 AP1 on the way north, and .44 AP2 on the way south today, 60 miles on I-5 each way. AP2 was more stable, with better lane centering. The weather was the same, clear, but it was getting dark on the trip back. I had to intervene less with AP2. AP1 was smoother.
Of course that smoothness still seems to come at a cost. I took both cars through the same (very tricky) local corner. AP1 stayed engaged while it smoothly sent me into the opposing lane. AP2 disengaged every time on previous firmware versions, sometimes with hard braking. On .44 it now makes it through the corner. This particular corner is an S curve to the right over the crest of a hill. It's very tricky as the new lane direction isn't visible until quite late, and by the time it is you need to pick it up and then immediately straighten back out. I was very impressed by AP2 with the current firmware. If the recent improvements are signs of a stable underlying core, I'm cautiously optimistic for quick improvements over the next year.
Of course that smoothness still seems to come at a cost. I took both cars through the same (very tricky) local corner. AP1 stayed engaged while it smoothly sent me into the opposing lane. AP2 disengaged every time on previous firmware versions, sometimes with hard braking. On .44 it now makes it through the corner. This particular corner is an S curve to the right over the crest of a hill. It's very tricky as the new lane direction isn't visible until quite late, and by the time it is you need to pick it up and then immediately straighten back out. I was very impressed by AP2 with the current firmware. If the recent improvements are signs of a stable underlying core, I'm cautiously optimistic for quick improvements over the next year.
I love uninformed expert opinions like this. FYI the Audi A8 autonomous systems are all marketing bluster. The Level 3 system works up to 35mph in traffic. It's like AP2 when it was first released, for all intents and purposes useless unless you are in a traffic jam on a freeway.
Does it really truly completely disengage? Or does it just give an alert to take over but it actually will still keep steering as best it can if you do not take over?
I expected worst given all the comments about how inferior AP2 was. I do miss seeing vehicles in other lanes however
The latest two or three AP2 firmware versions indeed are much better than what was released over the previous months. The situation used to be much, much worse.
I replaced my S 75D with AP2 with an S 90D with AP1. For me the new one is near perfect for my needs.
1. The auto high beam works almost perfectly. Just as good as my previous cars (mostly BMWs). The auto high beam in the AP2 car was a joke and I had to turn it off. Every car I met blinked at me...
2. Rain sensing wipers. Works great.
3. TACC works great. Doesn't do those annoying braking for ghosts the AP2 car did.
4. I like how AP1 uses the camera to read speed limit signs. The AP2 didn't do that. Not where I live anyway. It showed the wrong speed limit often as a result of that.
As for the actual self steering capabilities? Well, I only use it occasionally on freeways. It's not something I rely on every day and I actually prefer to steer myself. But when I've tried I think the AP1 at least feels more calm and confidence inspiring. I don't do tests in difficult passages because why would I? I want to live another day... It takes a lot more attention for me to keep watch over the AP system than to steer myself unless it's a very straight and boring road.
1. The auto high beam works almost perfectly. Just as good as my previous cars (mostly BMWs). The auto high beam in the AP2 car was a joke and I had to turn it off. Every car I met blinked at me...
2. Rain sensing wipers. Works great.
3. TACC works great. Doesn't do those annoying braking for ghosts the AP2 car did.
4. I like how AP1 uses the camera to read speed limit signs. The AP2 didn't do that. Not where I live anyway. It showed the wrong speed limit often as a result of that.
As for the actual self steering capabilities? Well, I only use it occasionally on freeways. It's not something I rely on every day and I actually prefer to steer myself. But when I've tried I think the AP1 at least feels more calm and confidence inspiring. I don't do tests in difficult passages because why would I? I want to live another day... It takes a lot more attention for me to keep watch over the AP system than to steer myself unless it's a very straight and boring road.
Update with .44:
AP2 seemed much better this commute. Was able to stay engaged (and even turned a car blue in front of me to follow it) in what I would call most of the "safe" places. It still hugged the lines a bit too much, and two times decided to just ignore the left line and go into the next lane on its own w/o any sort of beep or other warning that it no longer knew what to do in the situation. Also didn't have any of the random RED beeps and slow downs because a car was oncoming in an adjacent lane. Whew!
To address a comment above by Verdi re: auto-high beams - my car seems to do those perfectly. In some cases it turns off for no reason (I think due to reflective signs), but I have yet to have it keep on when a real car is coming my way or is in front of me.
AP2 seemed much better this commute. Was able to stay engaged (and even turned a car blue in front of me to follow it) in what I would call most of the "safe" places. It still hugged the lines a bit too much, and two times decided to just ignore the left line and go into the next lane on its own w/o any sort of beep or other warning that it no longer knew what to do in the situation. Also didn't have any of the random RED beeps and slow downs because a car was oncoming in an adjacent lane. Whew!
To address a comment above by Verdi re: auto-high beams - my car seems to do those perfectly. In some cases it turns off for no reason (I think due to reflective signs), but I have yet to have it keep on when a real car is coming my way or is in front of me.
I've heard that auto high beam can be different from car to car. The problem with my AP2 car was that it was too late to turn the high beam off when I was on a long straight. On curvy roads it worked just fine because then it would instantly turn off when required. But on longer straights the cars I met felt that I was much too late. I had to turn it off manually all the time until I finally gave up and turned the feature off completely.
The feauture is a lot more sensitive in the AP1 car. Sometimes maybe a bit too sensitive but I prefer it that way.
Huh, didn't know that. And I agree - a bit more sensitive is better than angry folks coming towards you!
Every time I drive my car the blindspot alerts piss me off. I get irritated when I pass a semi and after I see the driver's face the instrument cluster shows me I have something to my right. At highway speeds, it is simply too slow. Every other car with blindspot shows adjacent obstacles instantaneously. If they can't fix some of these basic issues, not sure how they will ever get to EAP. The sensor suite is just lacking. We're still only using 1-2 cameras over 1 year later.
I don't know, because I was not willing to just go along for the ride while it sawed back and forth in to the other lane.
thecloud
As rhythm raced inside, the ship came alive
Sawyer8888
Member
I have an AP1 loaner right now while my AP2 car is being fixed. I've also had an AP1 loaner a few times before this most recent SC visit. While getting closer, I still agree that 1 is better than 2 (both are on .42), and I think OP's assessment mirrors mine. Overall, AP1 still feels smoother than AP2, however AP1 still likes to
- jump toward those off-ramps as it hunts for a lane line
- overshoot when changing lanes automatically, sometimes crossing into the lane adjacent to the one you just moved into
- accelerate slowly to catch up to the car in front when starting from a stop in slow traffic
- Does a better job following the lead car when lane lines disappear, such as through intersections
- Reads speed limit signs (this can be a negative when in school zones and school is not in session)
- Rain-sensing wipers
- Auto-headlights operate better
...said so many Tesla owners. I am glad more loaners were just made available to service centers around the country.
Oh my god, that's a thing? I only briefly tried the auto lane change back when I did my AP1 testdrive, but AP2(at least in .42+) is very good at smoothly moving into the center of the adjacent lane and staying there.
eye.surgeon
Active Member
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