We Don't Need No Stinking Badges

[SageBrush]

personally, i like that there's no badging the model 3's. it goes with the simplicity of the car. but it will be cool to see people customizing and badging their own. It also guides people to focus on the more important issue, range, not battery size. other cars can have the same battery size but they're not as efficient so they get less range

In some ways similar to the Ghz wars of consumer computers or pixel wars of cameras when people shopped by the numbers instead of the performance.

 

[T34ME]

It has scientifically been proven that removing the badges increases range by 5%! I know it's true because I read it on the Internet!

 

[insaneoctane]

I do understand that getting away from kWh badges is a smart move for Tesla. That would not preclude them from badging the big battery cars with "LR". It is a relevant distinction at least for resale.

 

[Patrick0101]

Sorry I meant to say 3-4 cells per brick. And of course they will need a tooling change to switch from just putting in cells, to also filling it with blanks. And since those blanks don't need wiring, they need to change tooling for the wiring, too. And if you do that with every little iteration, just to keep range exactly the same, you're going to go crazy.

And in the end you just have saved 20 million a year, which is pretty much peanuts. That's what it costs to employ maybe 100 Engineers, which you need to change the wiring machines software, adjust the BMS, find some pattern where the blanks fit best and of course the biggest part, get to that 1% improvement and figure out how many cells you can leave out to keep range the same, which probably isn't even really possible, since the LR pack only has 31 cells per brick. So you can only go in roughly 3% increments.

So it's a zero sum game at best.

Good points.
When you are doing things at volume, small improvements add up and the tooling & engineering needed for a BOM savings quickly pay off. I agree that they may do it in chunks bigger than 1%, such as the 3% that you suggest. 1% was to show that even small changes could have a big impact, but 3% might work better given the call layout and required implementation efforts.

PS. I wish I could refer to $20 million as peanuts.

 

[R.S]

Good points.
When you are doing things at volume, small improvements add up and the tooling & engineering needed for a BOM savings quickly pay off. I agree that they may do it in chunks bigger than 1%, such as the 3% that you suggest. 1% was to show that even small changes could have a big impact, but 3% might work better given the call layout and required implementation efforts.

PS. I wish I could refer to $20 million as peanuts.

I mean, once they have a new generation of cells, there is certainly a point in reducing the number of cells to make it cheaper. But kWh would still stay the same and they never advertised number of cells before.

Efficiency gains are lower and those would allow to use less kWh, but then they would have the range increase for two 1% increments, to then just drop it again? What if they get to a 2.8% improvement due to many factors, make the car have 226 miles of range, or 219? Those are the two choices. I think they'd take 226. Or should they save up all improvements just to get to one of those 3% jumps?

What I want to say is that really isn't as fine tunable, as to keep range as a fixed badge that never changes. Because of course it will, there is no way around it. That's why this whole point, the articles makes, is just stupid. And I would bet that this won't happen within this generation of the Model 3. Just because it's just too unlikely.

Leaving out cells because of new chemistry is a different topic. But that has nothing to do with not badging kWh.

Also Tesla actually never put their actual kWh on the back of a car, just some nice sounding number close, in most cases, to the actual kWh.

 

[Patrick0101]

Also Tesla actually never put their actual kWh on the back of a car, just some nice sounding number close, in most cases, to the actual kWh.

True, but these badges are commonly referred to as the pack size. Tesla's new method eliminates this appearance of a connection and frees them up to be innovative in many ways with iterations of the cars as long as they meet the range expectations that they've set for SR and LR.

 

[R.S]

True, but these badges are commonly referred to as the pack size. Tesla's new method eliminates this appearance of a connection and frees them up to be innovative in many ways with iterations of the cars as long as they meet the range expectations that they've set for SR and LR.

Basically yes, there is definitely no major downside to calling it SR and LR. Non that I can really find, nor did I hear one that really convinced me. Only if they had some intermediary phase like they had with the S/X 75, 90 and 100. But I see no real upside either.

Standard range and long range is equally cryptic as 55 and 80. People still don't know how much range it has. Calling it 220 and 310 sounds better at first glance, but that would actually be the most stupid of all naming conventions.

So while I don't really mind, I don't really understand it and still think it's an inferior solution to something, that never really was a problem.

 

[timk225]

I do understand that getting away from kWh badges is a smart move for Tesla. That would not preclude them from badging the big battery cars with "LR". It is a relevant distinction at least for resale.

Your average consumer grade Tesla owning idiot isn't going to understand the LR any better than a 55 or 70 on the back of the car.

 

[T34ME]

Your average consumer grade Tesla owning idiot isn't going to understand the LR any better than a 55 or 70 on the back of the car.

I'm a proud card carrying average grade Tesla wannabe owner idiot....and I understand the difference between 220 miles and 310 miles.

I never could figure out what "She's Real Fine My 409" meant! But gosh it had badges. "Feels like a spaceship"!

 

[run-the-joules]

Saves me the annoyance of having to ask for mine to be removed before delivery, or of taking them off myself. Badges ruin symmetry and are a pain in the ass to wax around.

 

[R.S]

I'm a proud card carrying average grade Tesla wannabe owner idiot....and I understand the difference between 220 miles and 310 miles.

I never could figure out what "She's Real Fine My 409" meant! But gosh it had badges. "Feels like a spaceship"!

But the car won't be called 220 or 310. Since that wouldn't really work globally. So it will be LR and SR, which is as confusing as 50 and 75.

 

[SageBrush]

But the car won't be called 220 or 310. Since that wouldn't really work globally. So it will be LR and SR, which is as confusing as 50 and 75.

Check out other manufacturers for truly mind numbing

 

[R.S]

Check out other manufacturers for truly mind numbing

So we agree Tesla's new naming convention isn't genius?

I totally agree that it isn't really bad, but it isn't genius either.

 

[souslik]

Batches, tail lights and number plates are silly ICE leftovers. What we need is one central non-trunk-lid-integrated display.

 

[N5329K]

Since badging, like key fobs, is so 20th century, perhaps Tesla might choose to go with a really up-to-the-minute way to differentiate product that will speak to their intended audience:

Short: The rare, short-ranged $35,000 model with no options (and basic black, you cheapskate)
Tall: The almost as rare long-ranged model with zero additional techie options, coming to a Store near you, some time or other, maybe
Grande: Long-ranged model with EAP, available so soon you'll get to tell us what we did wrong
Venti: Long range, dual motor, EAP, FSD, available next year (we hope)
Trenta: Long range, dual motor, EAP, FSD, Performance, FLAS (feels like a spaceship) available next year (we hope)

 

[S3XY]

Since badging, like key fobs, is so 20th century, perhaps Tesla might choose to go with a really up-to-the-minute way to differentiate product that will speak to their intended audience:

Short: The rare, short-ranged $35,000 model with no options (and basic black, you cheapskate)
Tall: The almost as rare long-ranged model with zero additional techie options, coming to a Store near you, some time or other, maybe
Grande: Long-ranged model with EAP, available so soon you'll get to tell us what we did wrong
Venti: Long range, dual motor, EAP, FSD, available next year (we hope)
Trenta: Long range, dual motor, EAP, FSD, Performance, FLAS (feels like a spaceship) available next year (we hope)

But then our car title would probably have the wrong name on it.

 

[ProphetM]

It doesn't seem like there is a naming convention at all, really. Standard range and long range are just descriptors. Just like a car with two engine options doesn't necessarily have two different names for them. They're just options, and all Model 3s are just Model 3. I'm good with that.

 

[T34ME]

So it will be LR and SR, which is as confusing as 50 and 75.

HUH!? This is the first I have heard about that! Could I have a link please? I don't find 220/310 confusing at all and it can easily be converted to KM for countries on the metric system.

I know that is the way (LR/SR) the cars are referred to on TMC, but TMC is NOT an official site for Tesla information. Sometimes members confuse TMC as the official source for Tesla information.

 

[R.S]

HUH!? This is the first I have heard about that! Could I have a link please? I don't find 220/310 confusing at all and it can easily be converted to KM for countries on the metric system.

I know that is the way (LR/SR) the cars are referred to on TMC, but TMC is NOT an official site for Tesla information. Sometimes members confuse TMC as the official source for Tesla information.

I thought those were the names of the cars. Articles like these use it as names: Tesla Model 3 Will Come In Standard & Long Range (310 Mile Range) Version, Full Specs Revealed

Or are the cars now nameless? Or is the EPA mileage the name? Which will be equally cryptic to anyone using the metric system, most of the world. Or will the northern Irish be stuck with 310s while the people from the Republic of Ireland can buy much cheaper 355s. Or is it going to be matched to the local driving cycle? China will switch to the WLTP in 2020, so will the names change?

 

[T34ME]

I thought those were the names of the cars. Articles like these use it as names: Tesla Model 3 Will Come In Standard & Long Range (310 Mile Range) Version, Full Specs Revealed

Or are the cars now nameless? Or is the EPA mileage the name? Which will be equally cryptic to anyone using the metric system, most of the world. Or will the northern Irish be stuck with 310s while the people from the Republic of Ireland can buy much cheaper 355s. Or is it going to be matched to the local driving cycle? China will switch to the WLTP in 2020, so will the names change?

I just checked the teslamotors.com website for the Model 3. They refer to the 310 mile version as with the "long range battery" and the 220 mile version as the "standard battery." There is no indication that they have made these the official names of the cars. Yes, miles will be converted to metric in those countries that have wisely adopted metric standards while the US remains stuck in measurement hell. Since Tesla is an innovator, I would love to see them call the the cars the "354"km and the "483"km here in the US! After all, Tesla does refer to the battery size of the MS/X by the metric system!