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Mid Range charging speed.
- Thread starter Cloxxki
- Start date
clostridium
Member
Chademo charges even on a Tesla have a somewhat different charging curve than Supercharging. They taper much later than a Supercharger (around 75-80% SOC) because their output is not high enough to potentially harm battery longevity at lower SOCs. It also seems to ramp up a little slower in my personal experience (based on a few charges when I had a Model S75D) than superchargers do but then run at max station output (up to 50 kW) until 75-80%.
If someone with an MR has Teslafi or can do the free trial you can see a graph of the actual charge taper.
clostridium
Member
There is a precedent for smaller Tesla packs having slower charging rates. The pack in the S75 had a lower max power around 100 kW rather than 120 kW. The data from A Better Route Planner - Tesla Battery Charging Data from 801 Cars - shows this well. The BTX5 battery is the one in the S75.
We experimented with our roommate's mid-range Model 3 last night. We plugged in at the Springfield, VA Supercharger at 50% state of charge on a half-warm battery and it did 40 kW. Unplugged and drove 15 miles to the Woodbridge Supercharger. We plugged in briefly at 40% with a warmer battery and it did 100 kW. We then drove the 15 miles back to Springfield and plugged in again at 38% state of charge and got 110 kW. On the last visit, it started to taper at around 45%, but the battery still wasn't fully warm, so I'm not sure how much of an impact that had.
We'll have to test a few more variables, but I suspect the mid-range can do the full 120 kW on a warm battery below 50% SOC.
So I have an official update. Drove the car hard for about two hours (speed limit was 80 mph, cold day with light snow). Plugged in at 8%. Charge rate quickly climbed to 118 kw and stayed there until about 50%, then tapered off gently. So, the bottom line, all is well, charge rates are topping out at the max available.
Great news for mid range owners!
How did Tesla manage to have both mid range and long range supercharging max out at 118 kw? Bigger battery suppose to have more voltage and allow higher charge rate. Is that implying that the Long range model 3 can actually do more than 118 kw once supercharger v3 comes out?
That's what I think. The max per vehicle on SCv2 is 120 kW, which I've seen a couple of times on our LR AWD, although it's usually around 117-118 at most locations.
There was once a regulatory filing document that stated the LR is capable of 520 A supercharging. That would be roughly 190 kW maximum.
Very good news indeed! So the Mid Range battery pushes them to 118/62? = 1.9C! That's significantly higher than we've seen from any Tesla, surely?
This offers hope that the Long Range might indeed accomplish well higher peak rates than it does today, once the V3 Supercharger is made available. It will however only increase speed for the duration of the ceiling at ~118kW, of course...
Extrapolating 1.9C to the 120kWh S&X pack I am feeling Tesla really ought to do now with those supposedly more dense and certainly taller 2170 cells, 120 x 1.9 = 228kW. But again, at best only during the time it now has the ceiling near 120kW.
We have to wonder whether at 1.9C, the throttling will be needed again where after a pre-set number of DC fast charge cycles the 90 labeled cars are made to drop from 118/86= 1.3C to 95/86 = 1.1C peak.
Long distance traveling on the V3 higher charging speed wave of >120kW would call for shorter distance stints but also vastly shorter stops. Overal travel time will be shortened.
This offers hope that the Long Range might indeed accomplish well higher peak rates than it does today, once the V3 Supercharger is made available. It will however only increase speed for the duration of the ceiling at ~118kW, of course...
Extrapolating 1.9C to the 120kWh S&X pack I am feeling Tesla really ought to do now with those supposedly more dense and certainly taller 2170 cells, 120 x 1.9 = 228kW. But again, at best only during the time it now has the ceiling near 120kW.
We have to wonder whether at 1.9C, the throttling will be needed again where after a pre-set number of DC fast charge cycles the 90 labeled cars are made to drop from 118/86= 1.3C to 95/86 = 1.1C peak.
Long distance traveling on the V3 higher charging speed wave of >120kW would call for shorter distance stints but also vastly shorter stops. Overal travel time will be shortened.
One more data point. Pulled my MR into a SC after driving over an hour in 25 degree weather (F) at 13% SoC. Pulled up to 116kW, 480 miles per hour.
Did you ever get better charging speed at your next supercharging session? I pulled up to a supercharger at Gaithersburg, MD this morning and was getting 40KW with a SoC of about 40%....
Been testing battery charge speed here too. Everything the said in this forum about low SoC and higher temp to make charging faster is true. Got 106 kw at 450mi/hr when done right. Though only got that on the 3rd supercharger within the same station. First two gave me oddly low numbers. Anyone know has experience getting different charging speeds due to different superchargers even though the car SoC/temp is similar?
TJKR
Member
That is a fairly common issue. It happens on the older chargers that are wired in pairs... normally numbered like 2A and 2B... you can only max out on 120 KW if there is only one car but two cars it'll lower to like 70 KW. Avoid parking right next to another car if you charge if there is space available. Also if there is a problem with the charger it could limit the power output. If you go to a Supercharger that is relatively empty and don't get full charge, you should try another spot. The one good thing about the urban chargers, even though its only 72 KW, you always get 72 KW and urban chargers being relatively new, you normally don't have issues getting that.
Thanks for the tip. I read that some chargers are connected together too so was trying to watch out for that. The first charger I got to had no cars parked on either side of me but still topped at barely 51kw. 2nd charger was even worse and topped at 35kw, though I didn't wait too long before switching out. Then 3rd one got me my 106kw and by then the station was full, yet I still got 106kw. I guess it's a hit or miss until I get speed I want. Is the 2A/2B written on the superchargers themselves somewhere? Need to pay attention to that next time. This was at the Mountain View supercharging station, so could be one of the older, first gen ones I suppose. Also any idea if there is some sort of threshold at 35kw? even the 3rd charger stopped at 35kw for about 15 sec before shooting up to 106kw.
Yes, those labels are on the base of each station. And keep in mind that it's not always the spaces next to each other. At some locations, the installers laid them out in a different order, where it is 1A 2A 3A 4A 1B 2B 3B 4B. So the paired ones of 1A 1B are three spaces away from each other. But the naming is always accurate, where each number corresponds to the stack of charging hardware, and the A and B are the sharing parts of it.
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