FSD Beta 10.69

[sleepydoc]

No. In practice you just drive the surface streets yourself, and turn it on for monotonous high speed roads with little traffic, like freeways and highways.

No, in practice I let it do almost everything. In my limited experience with 10.69.2 there still appear to be some areas where it consistently has issues but fewer than before. Today It drove home from work (25 minutes, about 12-14 miles with mixed residential roads, feeder roads and highways) with only one intervention: A it ducked into a turn lane instead of going straight. It always had problems with this spot in 10.12 and will get it right about 50% of the time in 69.2. Other than that it was perfect.

I also had it drive from a Minneapolis suburb to downtown Minneapolis. I got me within a mile of my destination but had problems with a parkway that was unmarked and fairly narrow but actually 2 way traffic (see below.) It never did anything dangerous and would move over to the right when another car approached but I disengaged primarily out of courtesy for other drivers. Prior to that it had driven about 19 miles on residential roads, larger feeder roads interstates and downtown Minneapolis streets with no interventions at all.

 

[sleepydoc]

Not sure what you’re talking about. I do it all the time. See the video above. That’s extremely aggressive driving by your standards and I did not touch the brake once. Standard practice. Tesla makes it easy.

If you are driving aggressively and following closely it's virtually impossible to always time the regenerative braking without getting too close to the cars in front of you. If I don't have a car in front of me it's easy.

I have a Toyota Highlander that weighs something like 5000 pounds and I have no problem getting to 50mph in 7 seconds.

The reported 0-60 time for a highlander is 6.7 seconds. That's pushing it all out. Going 0-50 in 7 seconds will still be pushing it quite hard. I timed my car earlier today - 0-50 was 13 seconds. It was smooth, comfortable and almost exactly even with the car next to me. By your posts I've concluded you're actually a fairly aggressive driver and just not happy with a more reasonable rate of acceleration. That's fine if you don't like it, but as I and others have said, it's no more than a preference and no more worthy of critique than the color of the car.

That’s sometimes what happens but not always what happens. I’ll post some videos at some point, or you can just watch the variety of videos already available.

Specifically: sometimes it uses regen, then inexplicably eases off of regen significantly for a second or so, then uses brakes and regen. That is clearly without any debate not optimal and results in excess brake use. It’s bizarre and I know it is not just me since it is in many of the videos I see.

I experience that occasionally but in general I've found the braking in 69.2 to be much smoother than it was in 10.12. When I brake I'm constantly evaluating and adjusting based on traffic and stopping distance. I suspect FSDb is doing the same thing, just not as accurately. I liken it to a new teenage driver (that learns much more slowly)

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

No, in practice I let it do almost everything. In my limited experience with 10.69.2 there still appear to be some areas where it consistently has issues but fewer than before. Today It drove home from work (25 minutes, about 12-14 miles with mixed residential roads, feeder roads and highways) with only one intervention: A it ducked into a turn lane instead of going straight. It always had problems with this spot in 10.12 and will get it right about 50% of the time in 69.2. Other than that it was perfect.

I also had it drive from a Minneapolis suburb to downtown Minneapolis. I got me within a mile of my destination but had problems with a parkway that was unmarked and fairly narrow but actually 2 way traffic (see below.) It never did anything dangerous and would move over to the right when another car approached but I disengaged primarily out of courtesy for other drivers. Prior to that it had driven about 19 miles on residential roads, larger feeder roads interstates and downtown Minneapolis streets with no interventions at all.


View attachment 852901

Incredible results. I definitely want to see video, but it sounds like we won’t see any.

 

[sleepydoc]

Incredible results. I definitely want to see video, but it sounds like we won’t see any.

Probably not. I can see if I can duct tape my phone to the headrest or something but I don't really feel like wasting money on a camera mount that I don't want or need.

 

[Dewg]

It's just my experience, and anecdotal at best, but I'll throw my hat into the sleepy and Alan discussion. When I'm on FSD Beta on city streets, and at the line of an intersection, when the light turns green my car is usually ahead of most people with the standard acceleration FSD Beta does. Yes, there are a few that gun it and get ahead of me, but I don't need to be "first" all the time. I'm happy with the average acceleration it does, and I'm still ahead of most off the line.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

If you are driving aggressively and following closely it's virtually impossible to always time the regenerative braking without getting too close to the cars in front of you. If I don't have a car in front of me it's easy.

I don’t follow closely, that would be silly.

It’s easy to accelerate briskly which means fewer people in front, and when you see lead cars, you just ease off and leave tons of room. Watch the videos…I think it is very clear when I feel uncomfortable.

The reported 0-60 time for a highlander is 6.7 seconds. That's pushing it all out. Going 0-50 in 7 seconds will still be pushing it quite hard.

No, not really, because we’re going to only 50mph, and that’s only 70% (not 83%!) of the energy as compared to 60mph, so assuming constant power (I have an “eCVT” (aka Toyota Hybrid motor/generator transaxle setup), so reasonable), it’s nowhere near all out. Remember I said 6-8 seconds. 8 seconds is fine!

So roughly, again assuming peak power throughout, if it can do 60mph in 7 seconds, getting to 50mph in 8 seconds requires only about 7/8*50^2/60^2, which is 60% of max power. Not even breathing hard! Peppy? Sure! But I said that.

It’s true that the last time I had a rental in England it had 90HP (!!!) with a manual transmission and I was extremely frustrated. I think most would be. Except you, I think.

I experience that occasionally but in general I've found the braking in 69.2 to be much smoother than it was in 10.12. When I brake I'm constantly evaluating and adjusting based on traffic and stopping distance. I suspect FSDb is doing the same thing, just not as accurately.

I would agree with all this, except maybe just smoother, not much smoother. I do think it is a bit better but it still struggles. I’ll post videos at some point with examples. I’d say 1 in 5 stops are very poor, with 2 in 5 leaving a bit to be desired, but does depend on traffic and speed (again, I’m talking stops from 50mph). It’s much better stopping on uphills than downhills, not too surprisingly.

 

[bobsmy]

1st real test of 10.69.2 today. Over all there is improvement in many areas and a few areas with no change and one or two areas got worse.
Improvements.
Turns are much smoother with little wheel jerking.
Creeping seems more confident and works in areas where it did not before. Turns after creep are more confident.
Lane changes into turn lanes when not turning is reduced significantly.
Overall much soother and more natural ride.
No change
stopping at yield signs still an issue.
acceleration too early into turn (city traffic turns )
FSD not interpreting map/route data in speed control. IE. Slow vehicle in front exits Tesla speeds up to 55 while GPS is announcing right turn in 500ft.
Got worse
phantom braking for no reason
phantom braking on semi sharp curves if vehicle is coming other direction even though other vehicle clearly on other side of well marked double yellow.

Overall 10.69.2 appears to be extra cautions. May be intentional with the wide release. if so hopefully Tesla will use results to open it back up.

I feel it is better than 10.12.2

 

[aronth5]

How often do you see your GPS location off like that? In my ownership of my model 3, (since early 2018), it's only happened 2x to me, both times after coming out of a parking garage. it resolved in under a minute.

Good point I know some testers wait until the GPS location is aligned to the route. before enabling FSD.

Probably why they are doing a new release.

You don’t notice that turning is generally a bit smoother (not to say without issues or occasional jerking)?

Lots of regressions but we expected that.

Some UPL turns now do seem a bit smoother and I didn't have any crazy jerkiness today on my 150 mile combination NoA/FSD drive like I had been having. 10.69 is just less predictable which may be the reason it seems worse for me.

 

[sleepydoc]

stopping at yield signs still an issue

Yes. Others have also posted issues with traffic circles which are basically the same thing.

Yield signs are essentially unprotected right turns. It’s odd that Tesla spent so much time on unprotected left turns without making significant improvements on unprotected right turns. They should actually be easier.

 

[GlmnAlyAirCar]

Ok. For some reason I always thought that (brake pedal reboot) was a debunked myth or something. didnt realize its an actual Tesla approved method of rebooting

It is debunked

 

[Mardak]

Just drove for 90 minutes over 35 miles with 0 disengagements (other than parking) with 10.69.2. Went from the office to airport to restaurant to home all on city streets, so plenty of intersections with some unprotected turns as well as lane changes, merges and forks. This was around 5pm, so there were plenty of other vehicles and some pedestrians and bicyclists.

• 1 potential safety disengagement for not yielding when exiting a parking lot
• 2 accelerator interventions: unnecessary creeping at 4-way stop and slowing for vehicle cutting out
• 1 speed adjustment: dropped to 10mph for parking lot instead of 18mph (otherwise +20% limit)
• 0 turn signal suggestions: no need to "push" the car into the appropriate lane
• 2 wonky lane selections: exiting the airport (lots of lanes around a curve) and turning left into a parking lot
• 1 really wide left curve getting really close to the curb for no good reason
• 1 unnecessarily fast acceleration to 30mph after a right turn
• a few uncomfortable speed bumps
• some drifting onto/over double yellow: probably for smoother turns and no oncoming traffic in these cases

 

[powertoold]

Nerd away:

10.69 = less phantom braking
10.69.1 = more phantom braking
10.69.1.1 = less phantom braking
10.69.2 = more phantom braking
10.69.2.1 = less phantom braking?

Also, he does love you.

 

[joelliot]

Nerd away:

10.69 = less phantom braking
10.69.1 = more phantom braking
10.69.1.1 = less phantom braking
10.69.2 = more phantom braking
10.69.2.1 = less phantom braking?

Also, he does love you.

I didn't get the earlier 10.69 versions, but I find 10.69.2 to have more phantom breaking then my previous FSD build. A couple of other things I noticed. Driving directly into the sun this evening, I got a couple of take over immediately notices and a message about system failing. The take over occurred twice when turning into the sun. I'm not sure about the error message, I only saw it once, but it's hard to watch the screen when it gives you a strike for looking. I'm also getting the system trying to clean the windshield at low sun angles, but the windshield is clean - at least on the outside. The car seems to panic sometimes around pedestrians, then it will zoom past people at other times. The car went rushing up to a police officer directing traffic by standing in the middle of the lane. I do the the pedestrians logic is a little off still, so hopefully that will get fixed before the wide release.

 

[qdeathstar]

Then how do you explain the many good drives for Omar under so many different conditions? You think he is doctoring his videos?

Where have you been at bro? The answer is yes, obviously.

 

[qdeathstar]

So far 10.69 has been pretty good except for one time where it wanted to pull out right into an oncoming car. I mean, it said it was creeping foward but I could feel the dirty look I was about to get from the Honda CR-V’s driver and opted not to only live once this one time.

 

[sleepydoc]

So far 10.69 has been pretty good except for one time where it wanted to pull out right into an oncoming car. I mean, it said it was creeping foward but I could feel the dirty look I was about to get from the Honda CR-V’s driver and opted not to only live once this one time.

It would be really nice if there was some sort of audible (or even visual) signal that it recognizes a car coming. There are times when it creeps out a bit and could be fine *if* it doesn’t go any further, but most of us aren’t willing to risk it and intervene.

 

[bobsmy]

I noticed an interesting speed bump response yesterday. Normally speed bumps are on roads with 30 -40 mph and Tesla slows to mid teens, I was leaving a park with speed limit at 20mph. Tesla slowed to about 8mph for speed bump. Did not realize slowing was proportional to speed.

 

[Supcom]

So far 10.69 has been pretty good except for one time where it wanted to pull out right into an oncoming car. I mean, it said it was creeping foward but I could feel the dirty look I was about to get from the Honda CR-V’s driver and opted not to only live once this one time.

It takes much faith to trust that it will stop when the creep is more like a jerk forward. I'd like that to be just a bit smoother. Well, maybe a lot smoother!

 

[archae86]

I noticed an interesting speed bump response yesterday. Normally speed bumps are on roads with 30 -40 mph and Tesla slows to mid teens, I was leaving a park with speed limit at 20mph. Tesla slowed to about 8mph for speed bump. Did not realize slowing was proportional to speed.

The only speed hump observance speed I've seen around here is 17 mph. Here in Albuquerque there is a particular wide white diagonal stripe pattern which is used on many speed humps. It seems detect nearly all which are so marked, and few if any which are not. I'm encouraged by your report that it can see other things and give other responses.

 

[GranularHail]

Top good/bad highlights of my experience after 4 days with 10.69.2:

Good:
I've had zero (yes literally zero) instances of it trying to cross the double yellow line and use the oncoming travel lane to pass queued cars at stop signs and traffic lights. It's rare for me to go a full day without this happening during the school year (typically on 10.12.2 it would do this several times per day), so 4 consecutive days is a very good sign. This is a big deal to me, and is really reducing my anxiety level on my daily commute.

Bad:
Although it seems to me so far that it can correctly draw the creep wall at the point beyond which you'd be in contact with cross traffic, FSD seems to like to zoom up to that creep wall as fast as possible. Even if FSD is planning to stop just barely in time, the crossing traffic thinks I'm going to cut them off and slams on their brakes. FSD also does this even when it can already clearly identify lots of conflicting cross traffic from where it already is, and seems to do it even when it has creeped far enough where further creep offers no additional visibility.