FSD Beta v11.x

Mardak · Feb 14, 2023

JulienW said:
Once it is released, even to select influencers it will be public and we don't have an NDA

Yes, non-employee customers won't have NDA. I'm referring more to subsequent FSD Beta releases after 11.3 as there will likely be a 11.4 or even 12.0. Maybe the NDA was less strict with so many 10.x releases and long gaps between these major version bumps, but even Elon Musk thought 10.69 was major enough to get that special versioning, and Tesla wasn't as strict then.

Mardak · Feb 14, 2023

powertoold said:
I don't have a good feeling about this car disappearing from TeslaFi

I wonder what took so long for this vehicle to be removed from the service as it sounds like Tesla had been cracking down since at least November with the initial FSD Beta 11 release spotted on Teslascope back on November 11th (and that owner immediately asking to have the data deleted, etc.). It would probably be pretty trivial for Tesla to identify the TeslaFi vehicle, so hopefully for that employee it was a removal because they realized it was leaking data as opposed to Tesla acting.

From Tesla's perspective, a NDA is a NDA that needs to be enforced even if this current application for protecting FSD Beta 11 status might not be that critical if it's actually close to wider release. There are probably other more important things to keep under NDA, so allowing an environment where it's only sometimes enforced probably isn't good practice.

Mardak · Feb 14, 2023

sleepydoc said:
is it possible that the vehicle disappeared as a result of a downgrade?

Unlikely in this case or the previous case of employee vehicle deactivating TeslaFi. Here's a screenshot of the deactivated account where the vehicle details are gone except for update history, which also shows that it didn't get a downgrade from FSD Beta 11.3:

EVNow · Feb 15, 2023

I've no idea why employees use teslafi etc and leak info - I wouldn't do this. Nor would a vast majority of people here. There is zero reward and serious risks.

momo3605 · Feb 15, 2023

EVNow said:
I've no idea why employees use teslafi etc and leak info - I wouldn't do this. Nor would a vast majority of people here. There is zero reward and serious risks.

I mean there's only 1. Doesn't seem like employeeS are doing this. It only takes one clueless person that leads to leaks. See how careful Apple is with their products, yet inevitably, one employee stupidly forgets his device at a restaurant and it leaks!

Also the fact that someone is running 11.3 isn't secret. Elon has said himself that it was released internally in November or something, and has used the 11.3 version number many times in public tweets

Mardak · Feb 15, 2023

EVNow said:
I've no idea why employees use teslafi etc and leak info

Most likely it was accidental. TeslaFi provides value to its users and also happens to provide public statistics on vehicle software, but the employee could have been completely unaware of the latter aspect. Maybe that person saw news around TeslaFi spotting FSD Beta 11.3 and finally connected the dots.

EVNow · Feb 15, 2023

vamike said:
I read EVNow's quote to mean just because those YT'ers are fans, influencers, and generally positive about Tesla doesn't make them Tesla "shills". In the same way that you being a fan, influencer and generally positive about Waymo doesn't make you a Waymo "shill". The problem is there is so much negativity around this site that anyone who is generally positive gets labeled as a shill.

Right - some people think it’s the “in” thing to call everyone a shill.

The fact is - YouTube influencers have a very strong motivation to continue to be Tesla fans (and those who are anti-Tesla to continue to be that way). Their subscribers expect them to be like that. If they deviate expect blowback - with people unsubscribing and stop watching. For eg. Tesla Daily’s Rob expressed his concerns that China demand is soft. He was slammed for that - even though he turned out to be correct later. There are very strong incentives to self-censor ….

powertoold · Feb 15, 2023

EVNow said:
Right - some people think it’s the “in” thing to call everyone a shill.

The fact is - YouTube influencers have a very strong motivation to continue to be Tesla fans (and those who are anti-Tesla to continue to be that way). Their subscribers expect them to be like that. If they deviate expect blowback - with people unsubscribing and stop watching. For eg. Tesla Daily’s Rob expressed his concerns that China demand is soft. He was slammed for that - even though he turned out to be correct later. There are very strong incentives to self-censor ….

The Tesla YouTubers aren't shills at all. They show you the full video, you can make your own conclusions. There are no Waymo videos where you can see the entire system (from the remote operators to the decision making and driving experience). Huge difference IMO.

Plus, there's no one trying to make Waymos fail (jjricks used to do that, but he's stopped because he's kinda trying to enter the industry from my understanding - basically he's a shill now lol).

momo3605 · Feb 15, 2023

powertoold said:
They show you the full video, you can make your own conclusions.

They upload the full videos of the drives they choose…it’s easy to go out on a route you know FSD does great on and make a “full video” it’ll never do anything wrong on. But I have countless routes that FSD can NOT handle, and if I upload those videos, FSDb will look like trash. You don’t see Chuck using a route where the planner puts him in the wrong lane ahead of a turn (very common issue for most people). Chuck is maybe the least shill, but all of them do the same thing. Only upload videos of routes that it already works well on.

CYBRTRK420 · Feb 16, 2023

Gbills said:
GUESS THE RELEASE DATE V11
Make your educated guess on the release date , to the general population, for V11.?.?.?.? My entry is 04/19/2023. Reply to this message and I will announce the winner. Good luck to all.

March 11 is my guess.

jeewee3000 · Feb 16, 2023

momo3605 said:
They upload the full videos of the drives they choose…it’s easy to go out on a route you know FSD does great on and make a “full video” it’ll never do anything wrong on. But I have countless routes that FSD can NOT handle, and if I upload those videos, FSDb will look like trash. You don’t see Chuck using a route where the planner puts him in the wrong lane ahead of a turn (very common issue for most people). Chuck is maybe the least shill, but all of them do the same thing. Only upload videos of routes that it already works well on.

Which is understandable behaviour of course: if you only get the limited releases of FSD by spreading the gospel about how great it is, you wouldn't wanna be too harsh regarding the errors of FSD since Tesla would cut you off immediately.

If viewers don't understand this watching these FREE videos, that's their own responsability.

"If something is free, you are the product."

powertoold · Feb 16, 2023

momo3605 said:
They upload the full videos of the drives they choose…it’s easy to go out on a route you know FSD does great on and make a “full video” it’ll never do anything wrong on. But I have countless routes that FSD can NOT handle, and if I upload those videos, FSDb will look like trash. You don’t see Chuck using a route where the planner puts him in the wrong lane ahead of a turn (very common issue for most people). Chuck is maybe the least shill, but all of them do the same thing. Only upload videos of routes that it already works well on.

They mostly test in similar areas and routes to help people see the progress being made. People shouldn't forget that they were recording since October 2021, when beta was making all kinds of atrocious mistakes. It just happens that there are way fewer mistakes nowadays because of actual progress.

As for beta in general... yes, there are plenty of locales and situations where it sucks. But we have to remember that it basically works on the entire continent, so there's bound to be areas where it sucks. It's funny because there are people on this forum who post examples of major fails, and then over time, they post less and less, as these fails get fixed.

If we look back at Whole Mars first SF videos vs now, it's night and day improvement, and it's not because he selectively shows only the good videos.

DarkForest · Feb 16, 2023

jeewee3000 said:
If viewers don't understand this watching these FREE videos, that's their own responsability.

"If something is free, you are the product."

They’re not free videos.

You either pay for YouTube (which I do), or you watch ads to pay for it. And on the other side, the content creators get paid directly from YouTube in addition to potentially doing sponsorships and getting funding in other ways (eg Patreon).

If you’re using an ad blocker, then you’re pirating the videos. Which is whatever. I’m not a cop. But pirating something doesn’t mean they’re free videos. It only means you didn’t pay for it.

Gbills · Feb 16, 2023

jeewee3000 said:
Which is understandable behaviour of course: if you only get the limited releases of FSD by spreading the gospel about how great it is, you wouldn't wanna be too harsh regarding the errors of FSD since Tesla would cut you off immediately.

If viewers don't understand this watching these FREE videos, that's their own responsability.

"If something is free, you are the product."

Almost a “shill”

jeewee3000 · Feb 16, 2023

Gbills said:
Almost a “shill”

I'm not defending them. Just saying I understand them. If I was WholeMars I'd be crazy to make videos about how crappy FSDb is in the real world.

kabin · Feb 16, 2023

I don't think we can look at one set of videos and say there's been great progress as the team cherry picks data for NN training as well as invests significant time on challenging scenarios. A clear example is Chuck's UPL where the team drove Tesla test vehicles, at the Florida intersection, a number of days to a couple of weeks collecting data and road testing before several SW releases. A more accurate gauge is the average customer's drive where the team seemingly never has enough resource or time to put out the many fires let alone smooth out the rough edges. So far these 'edge cases' haven't easily give up the ghost.

kabin · Feb 16, 2023

jeewee3000 said:
I'm not defending them. Just saying I understand them. If I was WholeMars I'd be crazy to make videos about how crappy FSDb is in the real world.

He has some occasional outbursts of frustration but quickly gets in line.

Gbills · Feb 16, 2023

jeewee3000 said:
I'm not defending them. Just saying I understand them. If I was WholeMars I'd be crazy to make videos about how crappy FSDb is in the real world.

I understand. Comment was a tongue n cheek with all the back and forth on the word “shill”

EVNow · Feb 16, 2023

momo3605 said:
They upload the full videos of the drives they choose…it’s easy to go out on a route you know FSD does great on and make a “full video” it’ll never do anything wrong on.

This is exactly what all other companies do. They have Millions of $ marketing budget, a large team of marketing folks, advertising company etc. Yes, these are the videos a lot of Waymo/MobilEye fans regularly post on this forum as "evidence" of how good they are.

Not Omar - he puts out so many videos it would be impossible for him to do those unless a large % of his trips are actually good. Its likely he doesn't put out videos that are really bad .... but the sheer quantity of videos he puts out shows the trips are good for him.

jmatero · Feb 16, 2023

Looks like they may need to remove beta from all vehicles. CNBC just announced the recall

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10.69 made me a shill

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