Jason71
Well-Known Member
Nope. Like i said. Happy to be proved wrong but i am very sceptical. I think it will be at best annoying and at worse dangerous. For now we may have to agree to differ.
-
Want to remove ads? Register an account and login to see fewer ads, and become a Supporting Member to remove almost all ads.
M3 Refresh - Are Indicator buttons really poor design?
- Thread starter Timbo13
- Start date
I didn't dare say this on the general forums, but I looked at the Neue Klasse Vision and thought "Another attempt to copy the Model 3".
the sample size is relatively small though. New model S/X only - high price, low volume, only been out a short while, in a country with limited roundabouts (yes some states have them).
Similar argument to those going ‘but this Ferrari has them’
mtndrew1
Active Member
I have an S loaner right now and my goodness are the indicators awful. A solution looking for a problem if I’ve ever seen one. Same goes for the dopey gearshift.
These designs make any car so equipped a non starter for me.
These designs make any car so equipped a non starter for me.
johnny_cakes
Member
This is how you use the turn signal in a roundabout. Bjørn calls it the ninja maneuver 
(jump to 2:38)
LiamPope
Member
Do you drive your car?? The M3 rack is pretty quick only 2 turns lock to lock, but 180 degrees lock can come up easily enough on a small island roundabout. Doesn't even need to be a tiny mini.
We got it worse here in LHD land - as we go round roundabouts steering to the left, the indicator buttons are going under rather than over. While you can keep your over-hand on the wheel up to 180 degrees lock or even more, your under-hand will twist off only around 90 degrees - your wrists don't go that way!
Check out Bjorn's video above - it's a pretty large double lane roundabout but it still needs around 90-100 degrees lock to get round. No way his left hand can stay on the indicator buttons, so he ends up having to bring his right hand in to indicate. What a joke!
pdk42
Active Member
you can easily test it yourself by buying S3XY buttons. They work fine to make simpler turns such as junctions etc like most American roads.
Roundabouts work mostly fine if you do NOT indicate upon entering one and just right before exiting. However this is not the legal code. Some bigger roundabouts where you actually enter the roundabout at a left angled curve, buttons are complete nonsense and dangerous.
As someone that has trouble using the scroll wheel volume control when it's upside down
i'm pretty sure i wouldn't cope with the indicators buttons when the wheel is turned.
More of an annoyance would be the dipped beam button, auto is much better but i still use manual a lot and can find the stalk very quickly to dip the lights if a car comes round a blind bend in the lanes, won't be so easy trying to find a little button that moves about.
i'm pretty sure i wouldn't cope with the indicators buttons when the wheel is turned. More of an annoyance would be the dipped beam button, auto is much better but i still use manual a lot and can find the stalk very quickly to dip the lights if a car comes round a blind bend in the lanes, won't be so easy trying to find a little button that moves about.
Jason71
Well-Known Member
If its like the S then the main beam button is a haptic button that you have to hold down to select main. on the S a circle starts to appear on the dash and you have to hold it until it draws the whole circle around the light icon if I recall correctly. so as well as having to hold it down, in theory you have to look away.As someone that has trouble using the scroll wheel volume control when it's upside down
More of an annoyance would be the dipped beam button, auto is much better but i still use manual a lot and can find the stalk very quickly to dip the lights if a car comes round a blind bend in the lanes, won't be so easy trying to find a little button that moves about.
I am sure you learn how long it takes after a while and the M3 has no dash so do they put it on the screen or use feedback to tell you its engaged?
Either way I doubt you would find it a great "innovation".
They should be on either side of the wheel as buttons that would at least make it kinda ok. Both on the one side next to each other is silly and could be dangerous as you need to actually look which button to press when they are so close.
I've driven an S in America and even there without roundabouts is quite awkward, granted I only had teh car a day so you may get more used to it over time but its a silly design choice.
On the other hand i do actually like the gear selection system and it worked fine in my limited experience.
I've driven an S in America and even there without roundabouts is quite awkward, granted I only had teh car a day so you may get more used to it over time but its a silly design choice.
On the other hand i do actually like the gear selection system and it worked fine in my limited experience.
There will be some people who will (pretend to) love this just because Tesla introduced it and Tesla can do no wrong. It might even be that people can get used to no stalks over time. But do the more rational among us actually think that buttons are an improvement over stalks?
If all you did were read comments on here and you were to make a conclusion about how people behave on roundabouts, you'd assume that 100% of the people indicate 100% of the time. But alas, go into the real world and you will see that, no matter the make of car, or whether they have stalks or not not many people do NOT indicate when exiting a roundabout.
I test drove that Model S Plaid with the Yoke (for fun, can't afford to get one) and drove around 5 roundabouts.. the first roundabout I was like "oh sh!t, i missed it!" (as in I tried to hit the button but missed it), the second one I hit it with some extra thought, then the 3rd one, bam, hit it even when steering wheel was turned. After that I started to think it was actually kind of easy.
Would I rather a stalk? Yes, 100% I would. But everyone has to weigh up the pro's and con's of the whole package when making a decision about a purchase of a car - isn't that normal with any purchase? It's just surprising to me how much effort people put into arguing (and evidently complaining, a LOT) about these things. I'm surprising myself by even engaging, but here I am trying to add a 1000th opinion to the matter.
I test drove that Model S Plaid with the Yoke (for fun, can't afford to get one) and drove around 5 roundabouts.. the first roundabout I was like "oh sh!t, i missed it!" (as in I tried to hit the button but missed it), the second one I hit it with some extra thought, then the 3rd one, bam, hit it even when steering wheel was turned. After that I started to think it was actually kind of easy.
Would I rather a stalk? Yes, 100% I would. But everyone has to weigh up the pro's and con's of the whole package when making a decision about a purchase of a car - isn't that normal with any purchase? It's just surprising to me how much effort people put into arguing (and evidently complaining, a LOT) about these things. I'm surprising myself by even engaging, but here I am trying to add a 1000th opinion to the matter.
Jason71
Well-Known Member
single press I think from the vid I saw.
From memory if you press it the high beam come on but unless you hold for a minimum period then they don't stay on if you release the button.
Assume a single press will dip them again. Holding down to dip would not be a good idea!
Jason71
Well-Known Member
I have been thinking about the indicator buttons as purely a dumb cost saving measure but actually it is as much ideological.
Why has Highland added more sound insulation, more speakers and a rear screen but taken away the stalks and not added the heads up display that the M3 has always cried out for?
Because Tesla's ethos is that pretty soon you won't be doing much if any driving so driver conveniences are not important so save money on them.
On the other hand if there is no one in the front seat how does a robo taxi passenger control the 17 speaker system and the AC as they are wafted to their destination? with a screen in the rear of course.
Sadly I still don't see any of that happening soon in the UK. So we are just stuck with an increasingly passenger rather than driver focused vehicle we still have to drive. Unless you buy something else of course.
Why has Highland added more sound insulation, more speakers and a rear screen but taken away the stalks and not added the heads up display that the M3 has always cried out for?
Because Tesla's ethos is that pretty soon you won't be doing much if any driving so driver conveniences are not important so save money on them.
On the other hand if there is no one in the front seat how does a robo taxi passenger control the 17 speaker system and the AC as they are wafted to their destination? with a screen in the rear of course.
Sadly I still don't see any of that happening soon in the UK. So we are just stuck with an increasingly passenger rather than driver focused vehicle we still have to drive. Unless you buy something else of course.
Similar threads
