5_+JqckQttqck
Active Member
That's the ESA for ya, goodle them and see their rating online; it's not pretty. They'll come for one thing and leave you a list of things to fix not related to what they came for. All in the name of safety
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That's the ESA for ya, goodle them and see their rating online; it's not pretty. They'll come for one thing and leave you a list of things to fix not related to what they came for. All in the name of safety
Any drawback of using JuiceBox Smart Grid EV charging Pro 40 over Tesla official charger?
papapodcasts
Member
The only drawback I've heard is that I won't be able to charge my M3 as quickly as with a Tesla charger.
The concern I also had was having to upgrade my panel for the Tesla charger and that was going to cost an additional 1500-2000.
I made a decision while I bought my 1st EV Leaf. I do think EV is the future, and upgrade to 200 amp will be necessary. You do not lose anything, 200 amp panel increases your house value.
Yeah, the load calculation can be important. Even if you use a gas stove, if there is an outlet for an electrical one, along with a breaker, it counts in the load calculation. To avoid that, you need to completely disconnect and remove from the panel, and label the stove socket accordingly as disconnected. I have had to drop my breaker to 50A and HPWC to 40A because I didn't want to rip out my dryer socket (we have a gas dryer). I haven't had it inspected yet (that's Wednesday), but my load calculation is at 159 A (just under 160A for the 200 A feed).
ESA inspection is unrelated to the rebate form. To schedule the electrical inspection (via ESA) you contact the ESA as per the instructions on the permit and on their web site (esasafe.com).
The rebate form is filled out after you have the vehicle and the inspection certificate.
johndorian
Member
Had Paolo from STS Ltd. do my surprisingly tricky install today. Had him run 6/3 wire from the back & finished basement of my house to the front into the garage where he ran the rest of the length through conduit to the charger. Very happy with the work, 8 hours of it, and the reasonable cost of $1100 + tax.
johndorian
Member
Realized I ignored OP's format requested, here we go:
Location: Mississauga
Electrian/Company: STS Ltd.
Work Done: HPWC Install through finished basement into 40A breaker on 100A home service.
Results: Excellent!
Price Paid: $1100 + HST.
akidesir
Member
What’s the distance from the back of your house to where the Wall connector was installed?
johndorian
Member
That's about 41', he wasn't able to do a straight shot so I'm estimating he ran around 50' of wire.
I'm going to start calling around for quotes. I have 200amp service to my panel. I use a gas stove (no outlet for an electric stove present).
I'm thinking of running 80amps to the HPWC. I'd like to future proof myself for the possibility of purchasing a Model X or Y in the future as well. Considering this, I'll have to ask the electricians if it is better to install a sub panel in the garage or into a junction box like the instructions for multiple HPWC's specifies.
Considering this, what gauge of wire needs to be used to achieve 80amps? What about 60amps? I have make sure I specify that they use copper wire and not aluminum, correct?
Thanks!
I'm thinking of running 80amps to the HPWC. I'd like to future proof myself for the possibility of purchasing a Model X or Y in the future as well. Considering this, I'll have to ask the electricians if it is better to install a sub panel in the garage or into a junction box like the instructions for multiple HPWC's specifies.
Considering this, what gauge of wire needs to be used to achieve 80amps? What about 60amps? I have make sure I specify that they use copper wire and not aluminum, correct?
Thanks!
You might as well do a subpanel in the garage if you want 80 A. They will run at least 3 AWG cable for either 80A or 100A because 4 AWG is just harder and more expensive to get. Make sure they run copper -- don't let them run aluminium even to a sub-panel. (It'll de-value your house, and has more risks associated with it, like connectors loosening and needing to be re-tightened after some use) .
If your house has more than about 2500 sq feet + a basement, I doubt there will be enough capacity to wire the charger for 80A even with a 200A service. Check out this posting of mine here (and the various related posts) -- it has lots of related info:
Why 50 amp breaker on NEMA 14-50 if M3 incl. cable max is 32 amps?
Do a quick load calculation yourself using the following calculator (it's easier than the one I linked in one of those other posts):
CEC Electrician Calculators
Note that you are limited to 160A total for your house with a 200A feed.
In my case, I come in at 159A total home load with the HPWC set to 40A and the breaker at 50A. Even if I remove the dryer socket (I have a gas dryer) from the calculations, I still cannot push it up to a 60A breaker.
Hope that helps a bit.
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Thanks. That is some good information. My house is 2850 sq ft with an unfinished basement. So if I had to go to 60 amps, would it still be recommended to run 3 awg?
Also for the calculator, will the Wattage spec that each field requires be found on an information label on each appliance?
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Basement being unfinished doesn't matter for the load calculation (it's 75% of the area for the basement regardless of usage). (Rule 8-110 in the 2015 CEC).
60A would typically be installed with 6 AWG unless you had more than 80-90 feet between the panel and the charger. (Even then, I suspect most electricians would push to 100-110 feet with 6 AWG -- but don't forget, you've got 24 feet of cable on the charger itself -- at least it's rated higher).
Depends on the price though, as well as technical practicality -- some typical 60A equipment (disconnects, breakers, etc) might not fit a 3 AWG cable into the connectors (I haven't checked that, but all connection points have a range of supported cable sizes).
Cable is a fair part of the parts price (about 50% in my case). And running that cable is a fair part of the installation cost. If the price isn't too much different for 3 AWG and you might later find a way to get the "rating up", then 3 AWG might be a reasonable choice.
If the cable run is easy to switch and not too long, then go with only what you need.
Most electricians will be able to give you good advice on this part at least. Or you can have them quote both (or tell you one is a bad idea).
Thank you very much for the detailed responses. My run should be between 20-40ft roughly depending on the path chosen. I'll definitely keep all of this in mind when obtaining my quotes.
Sorry, forgot to answer the Wattage question.
Typically yes (although I found my stove was labelled incorrectly -- very rare and odd). I'm not sure what an inspector will officially ask for, but for standard appliances that use plugs (i.e. that can be changed), the maximum of the appliance rating or 80% of the circuit rating might be more appropriate. For hard-wired appliances (like A/C, hot water tanks), you can certainly use the rating of the unit as they cannot be "swapped" by the customer without due consideration. [I'm stretching a bit here in this paragraph as I don't know for sure.]
Most appliances will give a maximum current rating (e.g. 12 A) and an operating voltage (220-240V). Sometimes, there will be a peak current rating (typically for compressor startup) and a continuous load rating. For load calculations, you can probably get away with the continuous current rating (although the circuit wiring and breaker must be rated for the peak current).
You always need to use 240V for the load calculation (it says so in the code, section 8-100).
If you cannot find the rating of the appliance, then use the breaker rating (which will be slightly higher than most appliances), or if you want to, use 80% of the breaker rating, as that is officially the maximum load you are supposed to have on the circuit.
(And as a reminder for anyone who needs a quick refresher:
Power (P, in Watts) = Voltage (V, in Volts) * Current (I, in Amps)
P = VI
e.g.:
Voltage 240 Volts
Current: 12 Amps
Power = 240 * 12 = 2880 Watts
)Current: 12 Amps
Power = 240 * 12 = 2880 Watts
A reminder, I'm not a certified electrician or an expert -- just done lots of reading recently on this. And the inspector's interpretation of the code may vary (and their's is the only one that matters in the end).
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