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[uk impact] Tesla Vision - Removal of UltraSonic Sensors

Durzel

Well-Known Member
Jul 17, 2019
5,408
4,629
Bath, UK
I'm not sure what's worse to be honest - having no distance measurements / chimes, as it is now on new cars, or Tesla adding a vision-based one that people start to rely on that isn't reliable.

I've been guilty a few times of catching myself listening out for the beeps when reversing instead of the mirrors. People get used to the technology, particularly when the implementation of it (beeps and/or distance measurements) has basically been the same across every car that has had them fitted. If Tesla's vision system tries to simulate that then i think people will naturally fall back into bad habits of relying on it.

I guess it's possible that Tesla will crack this with cameras, but I remained unconvinced - at least in the short term.
 

KennethS

Member
Supporting Member
May 3, 2019
952
775
Herts, UK
I'm not sure what's worse to be honest - having no distance measurements / chimes, as it is now on new cars, or Tesla adding a vision-based one that people start to rely on that isn't reliable.

I've been guilty a few times of catching myself listening out for the beeps when reversing instead of the mirrors. People get used to the technology, particularly when the implementation of it (beeps and/or distance measurements) has basically been the same across every car that has had them fitted. If Tesla's vision system tries to simulate that then i think people will naturally fall back into bad habits of relying on it.

I guess it's possible that Tesla will crack this with cameras, but I remained unconvinced - at least in the short term.
I rely on my own vision aided by the cameras (and obviously the mirrors) and the beeping for me is just an audible confirmation of impending hazard. That said, I would not be happy if the audible warnings were absent from our cars. If as you speculate the audible indications were present but mostly unreliable I think that would be even worse than not having it.
 
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We’ve found that we’re driving our Model 3 less and less in favor of our Ioniq5 with its full set of cameras, five radars, and suite of USS all of which provide ample convenience and comfortable safety. The M3 is used now for almost nothing, strictly a back-up vehicle.
Your signature says you have a 2018 Model 3, which will have full USS and 8 cameras.... so you are not impacted by the USS removal.....I assume your preference is for other reasons?
 
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Your signature says you have a 2018 Model 3, which will have full USS and 8 cameras.... so you are not impacted by the USS removal.....I assume your preference is for other reasons?
The trouble is that no Tesla has ever had the full suite of systems that other manufacturers provide. They post on Twitter about being a tech company, repeat that mantra in the stores (yes, the interior is crap but don’t worry you’re paying for the technology) and then roll out a low tech product. It is genius.
 
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Mullermn

Adapting to life without USS one hour at a time
Jun 25, 2022
178
252
Uk
I drove cars for over 40 years without park assist, and never once backed into anything. Just thought I'd say.
The only time in my 20+ years of driving that I reversed in to something was in a car with ultrasonic sensors. A tree was positioned perfectly to be outside the space at ground level, leaned in to the space at mid level, then went vertical. Sensors missed it, I was too used to relying on them and got a caved in rear as a lesson.

Tesla’s system (assuming it works as projected) wouldn’t have missed the tree.

On to a minor rant.. I get that cars aren’t as easy to park manually as they used to be, but Jesus, do none of the complainers on here (not directed at the parent post) ever drive a van? You never drive with a trailer? Or a bike rack?

And what’s with the ‘beeps are a safety feature’ line? Best of luck using that excuse when you have an accident.

Assuming you’re a fully featured human being, look at the space where you want your car to be and then use your spatial awareness to put it there. It ain’t rocket surgery.

I’ve been following this thread for weeks now because of the occasional useful fact that drops here, but to find them you have to wade through hundreds of identical, tedious whiny posts.

Ps. And yes, pulling the feature with (effectively) no warning and before the replacement is ready is a dick move, but if Tesla did things the way the other manufacturers do then this forum wouldn’t exist. Elon giveth and he taketh away as he sees fit.
 
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GRiLLA

Active Member
Jul 5, 2020
2,258
2,526
UK
The trouble is that no Tesla has ever had the full suite of systems that other manufacturers provide. They post on Twitter about being a tech company, repeat that mantra in the stores (yes, the interior is crap but don’t worry you’re paying for the technology) and then roll out a low tech product. It is genius.
If only there was some kind of way to tell what a car would be like before you buy it, maybe some sort of retail location where you could try them out, surely that would fix this issue completely. Failing that maybe if you could return the car for a full refund within the first couple of weeks once you discover how low tech it is. It's such a shame that you get tricked into this purchase and would probably have to endure a small profit to sell the car on.
 

KennethS

Member
Supporting Member
May 3, 2019
952
775
Herts, UK
We’ve found that we’re driving our Model 3 less and less in favor of our Ioniq5 with its full set of cameras, five radars, and suite of USS all of which provide ample convenience and comfortable safety. The M3 is used now for almost nothing, strictly a back-up vehicle.
Your signature says 2018 Model 3 -- they didn't arrive on these shores until 2019??
 
If only there was some kind of way to tell what a car would be like before you buy it, maybe some sort of retail location where you could try them out, surely that would fix this issue completely. Failing that maybe if you could return the car for a full refund within the first couple of weeks once you discover how low tech it is. It's such a shame that you get tricked into this purchase and would probably have to endure a small profit to sell the car on.
That would work if the model you tried was the model you got sold.... Pretty sure the test drives are still done in cars with USS. And the refunds are only valid up to 100 miles or so aren't they?
And profit for selling second-hand? That's ancient history now ;)
 
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GRiLLA

Active Member
Jul 5, 2020
2,258
2,526
UK
That would work if the model you tried was the model you got sold.... Pretty sure the test drives are still done in cars with USS. And the refunds are only valid up to 100 miles or so aren't they?
And profit for selling second-hand? That's ancient history now ;)
The ability to return is due to distance selling regulations, not something that Tesla can change. It's written in your sale agreement. My Jan ordered Model 3 that was delivered in June was prior the price rise, so yes I can sell it for more than I paid if I wanted to.
 
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James-R10

Model S Plaid 01/01/21 MSM/BlackCF/FSD/21" EU+ M3P
Aug 19, 2017
349
298
UK
If only there was some kind of way to tell what a car would be like before you buy it, maybe some sort of retail location where you could try them out, surely that would fix this issue completely. Failing that maybe if you could return the car for a full refund within the first couple of weeks once you discover how low tech it is. It's such a shame that you get tricked into this purchase and would probably have to endure a small profit to sell the car on.
Not so simple is it. What if you ordered at a lower price based on promised features that never came. If you return you have to buy in later at higher for instance.

All test cars actually have USS, so again your point is void on that front.
 
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It feels like 20 years since I’ve owned a car without parking sensors and I suppose I have become reliant on them like I have somewhat become reliant on SatNav (even tho I could still read a map if I owned one).

Additionally, I will opt out of tight spaces when parallel parking if I notice the car in front doesn’t have a camera or sensors and it’ll be tight for them to get out. I don’t trust the spatial awareness skills of other motorists. Just me?

I’m sure I could survive without them - and the rear camera is good for me - but I wouldn’t have bought the car without front sensors. I’ve spec’d them on much cheaper cars in the past.
 
So.

I picked up my car on Saturday without USS.
First thoughts:

During the day- absolutely fine, camera's are clear and you'll have to be a right idiot to hit anything.

At night: Completely different, the past couple days its been wet, dark and gloomy and the visibility from the rear camera is quite bad. Especially when you're backing up to something that can reflect light. Also when raining, I saw standing water drip down infront of the camera and it was pretty much impossible to judge where I was going. Its only because I was backing out of a driveway that I have done for many years I knew where everything was.

they need to fix this, Tesla has to come up with a happy medium, they need to somehow show the distance between objects.

The wife is not impressed we've just spent £60k on a car where theres no parking sensors.
Again I must reiterate - You'd have to be a right idiot to reverse into anything during the day, but my issue is at night.

As far as Autopilot is concerned, absolutely no issues.
Works like before, Auto High Beam was fine, Wipers were fine. Kept distances really well during the night. So no issues there.
 
The wife is not impressed we've just spent £60k on a car where theres no parking sensors.
We recently took delivery of a 2023 Y and this is my wife's chief complaint as well. Her work's garage requires tight maneuvering so it can be difficult to gauge where the front of the car is. I really dont understand why they would the remove the USS without first having a backup. The cameras are generally enough for me to maneuver the rear of the car without issue, but from my seating position, I dont even see the front of the car. I find myself being super cautious as I dont quite have a bearing on where the front corners lie (in comparison to my USS-equipped M3P.)

Interesting enough, we took delivery of our Y at a new SC location that parks deliveries at the top of a multi-level garage. To get out, we had to make these tight 180 turns; basically tight three point turns in an enclosed space. I imagine there's gonna be people damaging their new car trying to get out of there.
 
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