I think that taking a little personal responsibility for the 2 tonnes of metal you are hurtling about in would be a reasonable expectation.
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[uk] UltraSonic Sensors removal/TV replacement performance
- Thread starter randompixel
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By this logic we should remove all cameras, ABS, ATC, power steering, power brakes….
That is not a reasonable inference from the parent you quoted. Nobody’s saying driver aids are bad, just that they are just aids; you, as the meat in the seat have always bee responsible for the safe movement of your vehicle.
Therefore ‘I can run over anything and the car now just ploughs on’ with its implication that it’s the car’s fault if you now hit something is a dumb statement to make.
It's been a falsehood that Tesla themselves have never really shut down.. that their cars will automatically brake for pedestrians, even though it is in their interest to clarify to avoid headlines when they fail to do so.
eg. Tesla Car’s Automatic Emergency Braking Likely Saves Life of Child on Scooter
Leading to..
www.autoevolution.com
eg. Tesla Car’s Automatic Emergency Braking Likely Saves Life of Child on Scooter
Leading to..
Twitter Goes Berserk Over Old Video Showing Radar-Less Tesla Model Y Can't Stop for Kids
Things aren’t looking good for Tesla again. Two different tests show that going on the radar-less route might’ve been a mistake
www.autoevolution.com
I agree that this exists, and I think it is contributed to by the vague and changeable level of sophistication in Tesla’s software. The fact is that none of us driving them know exactly what it does and which scenarios it will respond to, other than the very high level descriptions in the manual. This leads to a lot of people publicly crediting the car for things it might not actually be doing.It's been a falsehood that Tesla themselves have never really shut down.. that their cars will automatically brake for pedestrians, even though it is in their interest to clarify to avoid headlines when they fail to do so.
eg. Tesla Car’s Automatic Emergency Braking Likely Saves Life of Child on Scooter
Leading to..
Twitter Goes Berserk Over Old Video Showing Radar-Less Tesla Model Y Can't Stop for Kids
Things aren’t looking good for Tesla again. Two different tests show that going on the radar-less route might’ve been a mistake
One example I remember is a Tesla cam video on YouTube of a Tesla seemingly performing an automatic crash avoidance manoeuvre triggered by a crash between the vehicle in front of the vehicle in front of the Tesla and the vehicle in front of that, before the collision had even happened. The sequence of events definitely played out that way - you can see it in the footage and hear the audio cues as the Tesla detects(/predicts) the collision, but is that the result of incredibly sophisticated modelling in the Tesla or just a random happy case where some other more mundane trigger caused it?
Maybe I shouldn't speak for the poster of this, but it was hyperbole. A rhetorical device used for effect in a conversation.
You keep quoting it over and over as if it's some literal action that's going to happen. Embarrassing, frankly.
As I said, this sentiment has come up frequently in these USS topics.
To my surprise there are apparently a significant number of individuals that DO rely on ultrasonic sensors as a safety feature, when they have never been pitched as one by any manufacturer and are not suitable for that usage.
So I don’t think you need feel embarrassed, but possibly some mild despair is justified.
Really?
Wow, that is certainly quite a leap!
I didn't suggest for a moment that driver aids are a bad thing, simply that it would be irresponsible to rely on them to the point of not being ready/prepared/able to intervene in the event the 'aid' (the clue is on the word!) proves to be less than 100% reliable. As the previously USS based 'aids' on recently delivered cars are currently AWOL, I don't think it should be beyond the wit of man/woman to manage this...to me a more sensible approach than simply hurling toys out of the pram.
My old Honda doesn't have USS's and somehow I've managed 15 years of driving it without ploughing into anything/one.
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Ford Model T did not have USS either and people managed to drive them around and park them.
15 years ago USS were part of a luxury package (if available); now they are standard like power steering, ABS, etc. The point of my post is not to absolve people from personal responsibility; it is to point the faulty logic of “You should manage” argument when applied to a $80k car. At that price point a customer is used to expect certain things and trust manufacturers to provide them.
Hansom cabs were a bugger to reverse as well but people managed it, usually by disconnecting the horse.
Of course you can reverse without USS but for reasons I set out here, it’s much more difficult. And why the hell should we???
I have no quarrel with that whatsoever.
However, if that was your intention, it was exceptionally poorly expressed in your post #1482!
Mr Puzzles
Member
I do, if you don't like what's included in a car regardless of the price don't buy it - simple as.
MrBadger
Badger out
And what about specs change between ordering and delivery (or worse, 3 years into ownership) and there are 1 year waiting lists and your finance deal is about to end so you are kind of caught by the short and curlys. Not so simple as…
The specs did change in my case and I decided if I still thought it was worth it, it doesn't alter the decision at all, it's not coming back so the decision is purely proceed or not proceed.
If a car purchase can result you being held in the short and curlys it's probably not a wise purchase to begin with.
MashinBenzin
Member
That’s a function of the recent new car market. It’s not as simple as backing out on a whim when there is nothing else to buy. Nothing to do with wise or not.
That’s implying you need a new car to your specification - and then when USS is removed it’s not your spec anyway - that doesn’t sound like a need there are plenty of options.
The issue is that unfortunately Tesla doesn't have a real competition when all things considered car + software + charge network + delivery time. I am pretty unhappy to get delivery without parking assist but there is no real alternative if I want a EV.
I have to deal with the disappointment, does not mean I wont criticize them. Even if there would be other alternative considering car + software plus charge network. Is it reasonable that I trash 6months of queuing for delivery?
I decided to still take delivery, but I find disrespectful that a car of this price is delivered without park assist and with this level of uncertainty whether tesla vision park assist will work with enough accuracy and when will be available.
100% it’s obviously a downgrade but what irks me is people equating the price of a vehicle to what it should have.
It’s got what it’s got voting with your wallet is more effective than debating things you can’t control on a forum - what is there to discuss? Let’s discuss what and when we might be getting rather than creating a no-USS survivors group.
I agree with you, but to recycle a post I made in an earlier USS thread:
Imagine that you're in charge of Telsa's operations and you have the following options (assuming that the underlying problem is that USS are in short supply across the industry and can't be obtained):
1) Suspend delivery of all vehicles until you can deliver them as specc'd
2) Deliver cars without and prepare for an expensive retrofit program, using your very low capacity service network (vs ICE vehicles that all visit service centres routinely)
3) Recognise that you were dropping this hardware anyway, so drop it a bit early.
(Note that 2 and 3 are the same result to the customer. You can't have USS if they're physically not available, so you'd have had to have had a car without them in a retrofit scenario.)
You'd be insane not to take option 3, with the offer for anyone who doesn't like it to cancel or defer.
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