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Elon, Where is the FSD features you promised?

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Got it! Sorry for portrait mode, but you can see the car follow the tar line and actually change lanes

Thanks for visualizing this.

Exactly what happened to me, though my turn was more aggressive and far more dangerous:

On this note, the second to last update tried to do this for me (posted earlied on this forim) - have not repeated the conditions on the last:

"Had the first "it tried to ruin my car and maybe hurt someone" moment with the AP2 (17.26.76) today. Roadworks caused a freeway to turn and narrow a bit, with a solid white line on both sides of the lane, adjoined by another lane on the left (and beyond that a highway divider, behind which the opposing lanes) and by concrete blocks on the right. No problem with this for AP2, as the markings were clear and the weather was nice enough. Really, the road was clearly marked, the only problem was slightly narrower lanes and no room for error on the sides, so this was not the "road markings lead to a concrete divider" scenario at all.

Suddenly the road has a sort of diagonal, but partial (not fully across the lane) dark line going across the lane, covered in pitch/resin. Probably some remnant of old road markings or covering some cavity on the road or temporary changes made to the road during the work there. The actual roadmarkings on the side continue as usual in bright white, while this diagonal line twists/turns to one side, but again is dark and not a road marking by any standard. There are straight, solid, bright white lines marking the road on both sides of the lane. But this dark line does end under the left-side road marking, so it sort of starts extending from that.

It is sufficient for me to stiffen up expecting the worst - half thinking to myself I've spent too much time on TMC and am now dreading the unnecessary. Until now the only real problems with AP2 had been ghost brakes at overpasses (one bad, many unpleasant) and terrible undivided road performance. It had been pretty good on divided roads (which I was on), as far as following lane markings in good weather go...

But sure enough, AP2 starts turning alongside this sort of diagonal line! Straight towards those concrete blocks lining the lane on the right side! I mean - it stopped following beautiful, solid while lines on both sides of the lane and chose to start following a dark, partial twist in the middle of the lane into concrete obstacles. An absolutely insane decision from the EAP that just shows how limited its ability at the moment is... even if those road markings had not made sense, there was a huge wall of concrete right next to the lane it wanted to turn into, instead of that beautiful free air straight ahead.

It took a very strong twist of the already turning steering wheel on my part to cancel this movement. Everyone else in the car was stratled, though personally I was ready and was reacting, so it was more like adrenaline kicking in on my part.

Later on on the trip it got very confused again when overtaking and wanted to start following a car on the adjacent lane. At that point I just turned it off and drove the rest of the way. It stays off for now.

Other than that, staying within lane was slightly less ping-pongy for me. The overall feel is more aggressive than previous versions, I would not call it silky smooth."
 
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Even with the flaws, its still the leader ... Tesla's Autopilot Is The Frontrunner In Vehicle Autonomy

autopilot-1492465618876.gif
 
On the main Model S page

Model S | Tesla

Roughly the second item down is the full self driving feature with video:

"Full Self-Driving Hardware on your Model S
All Tesla vehicles produced in our factory, including Model 3, have the hardware needed for full self-driving capability at a safety level substantially greater than that of a human driver."

That's all it says! I think that is carefully worded and really has to be intentionally deceptive. What else? Only by clicking the Learn More button do they much later explain what's going on. This is holding Tesla to a different standard, but that's the main reason I mention it. :) All companies, everywhere, lie and scam. Tesla shouldn't.
 
Hence all the controversy. None of the other manufacturers are willing to do so until they have something to sell. Smarter lawyers.
Tesla is somewhat lawyer-proof now. People are hesitant to potentially become "the guy that shot Tesla down/impeded their mission/whatever".
This is why a bunch of other lawsuits that were in the wings for some time are still not there and people are just trying to talk some sense into the Tesla.
It's everybody's guess how long that would last.
 
We give Tesla a lot of flack for the whole FSD debacle. For good reason as they've boxed themselves in a corner. They didn't give themselves room for a normal progression of adding features as they became VIABLE. Instead they made promises right out of the gate about the potential of the hardware on a HW2 car.

Now I don't know how Tesla will handle the situation as it unfolds. Maybe partial refunds to those that bought the FSD option, or maybe costly HW upgrades. I haven't even seen an admittance from them in any shape or form that this whole FSD isn't to be with HW2. At least not to the extent that was shown.

But, I also question what the right approach is?

How do you package SW progression into the cost of a car? That fairly reflects the goals of it, and the challenges due to regulatory unknowns.

The OTA SW upgrade model is unique to Tesla because the dealership model used by other car companies complicate the OTA upgrades. If it is seen as enhancing the car then the dealership wants their cut.

By the very nature of the SW upgrade model Tesla is in a position of always selling a promise that they might not be able to deliver on. Which is the same way technology companies have operated for quite sometime. They say something will do X, but then Y years later you're still waiting for it. We forgive/forget because the cycles are so short.

Even if the SW was ready Tesla would be selling something that couldn't be turned on. Just like the situation Audi is going to be in with the A8. Where they have a car that they believe is capable of L3 in limited situations, but they're waiting for regulatory approval. If it doesn't get approval (for whatever reason) they're going to be in a bit of a pickle.

For me L3 and beyond is really what I care about. My AP1 Model S already does L2 decently enough that I'm not motivated to get just another L2 car.

The Audi A8 isn't all that compelling either due to the limited speeds. Where I live often times you can have bumper to bumper traffic that suddenly opens up to 50mph, and then slams right back down. The 37mph limit would be annoying to say the least.
 
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Tesla is somewhat lawyer-proof now. People are hesitant to potentially become "the guy that shot Tesla down/impeded their mission/whatever".
This is why a bunch of other lawsuits that were in the wings for some time are still not there and people are just trying to talk some sense into the Tesla.
It's everybody's guess how long that would last.

The funny thing about this is Tesla managed to get themselves sued by people in Norway.

It's funny because I picture people in the US as being sue happy. Yet, it was Norwegians that sued.
 
The funny thing about this is Tesla managed to get themselves sued by people in Norway.

It's funny because I picture people in the US as being sue happy. Yet, it was Norwegians that sued.

:)

I know your comment was in jest, but two ponderings still:

Probably a result of both the nature and written word/precedent of the local law. The U.S. system being more geared towards lucrative liability lawsuits, where are Norway is more about general consumer protection against manufacturer errors...

Also, Tesla used some even more misleading official HP registrations in Norway, if I recall.

Part of this is just a co-incidence of course.
 
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We give Tesla a lot of flack for the whole FSD debacle. For good reason as they've boxed themselves in a corner. They didn't give themselves room for a normal progression of adding features as they became VIABLE. Instead they made promises right out of the gate about the potential of the hardware on a HW2 car.

Now I don't know how Tesla will handle the situation as it unfolds. Maybe partial refunds to those that bought the FSD option, or maybe costly HW upgrades. I haven't even seen an admittance from them in any shape or form that this whole FSD isn't to be with HW2. At least not to the extent that was shown.

But, I also question what the right approach is?

How do you package SW progression into the cost of a car? That fairly reflects the goals of it, and the challenges due to regulatory unknowns.

The OTA SW upgrade model is unique to Tesla because the dealership model used by other car companies complicate the OTA upgrades. If it is seen as enhancing the car then the dealership wants their cut.

By the very nature of the SW upgrade model Tesla is in a position of always selling a promise that they might not be able to deliver on. Which is the same way technology companies have operated for quite sometime. They say something will do X, but then Y years later you're still waiting for it. We forgive/forget because the cycles are so short.

Even if the SW was ready Tesla would be selling something that couldn't be turned on. Just like the situation Audi is going to be in with the A8. Where they have a car that they believe is capable of L3 in limited situations, but they're waiting for regulatory approval. If it doesn't get approval (for whatever reason) they're going to be in a bit of a pickle.

For me L3 and beyond is really what I care about. My AP1 Model S already does L2 decently enough that I'm not motivated to get just another L2 car.

The Audi A8 isn't all that compelling either due to the limited speeds. Where I live often times you can have bumper to bumper traffic that suddenly opens up to 50mph, and then slams right back down. The 37mph limit would be annoying to say the least.

There are no regulatory challenges to selling a L3 car with a human driver behind the wheel. The right approach is an apology and refund from Tesla plus a buy back at FMV for those who want that. And a promise to not lie to consumers in the future. None of this will happen though, until Tesla is compelled to do so by the courts. I know plenty of lawyers that don't give a flying F about Tesla or interfering with "their mission".
 
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