FSD Beta 10.12

[Supcom]

Drove 360 miles today, mostly interstates and secondary roads, almost all using FSD. I have driven this route before using Autopilot and NOAP, and FSD is a big improvement. That said it definitely needs work.


The really bad: FSD will happily drive past a stopped school bus with flashing red lights and stop sign extended. WTF

The weird: The car would suddenly move into the left lane with the message “Moving out of rightmost lane” without my approval. The third time it did it I realized it was treating the long left exit lanes as a third travel lane, and felt it was important to get out of the right lane ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

The bad: While navigating to a store in a mall, it tried to stop on the 4 lane highway near the store when the store was on the other side of a berm, even though the nav had the correct route.

Started making a left hand turn, but spotted some orange cones marking the entrance and stopped in the oncoming lane (Tesla orange cone phobia)

Refused to turn into my gravel driveway

Ignores “no right on red signs”


The good:

Almost no nagging unless I spent too much time looking at the screen.

It recognized and responded correctly to all red lights, green lights, yellow lights and stop signs.

I can drive more than 5 mph over the speed limit on secondary roads using FSD.

It would mostly exit one road and merge onto the next without drama. Traffic was light, so not sure how it would work with heavy traffic.

Ignoring school buses is a well-known FSD beta deficiency. The car also ignores active school zones, so be alert for those as well.

Unlike NOA, FSD beta never waits for approval before making a lane change. There is no setting for this. FSD beta moving into left-turn only lanes when intending to continue straight is a well-known FSD beta deficiency.

Ignoring "no turn on red" signs is a well-known FSD beta deficiency.

 

[LincolnsDoctor]

Unlike NOA, FSD beta never waits for approval before making a lane change. There is no setting for this. FSD beta moving into left-turn only lanes when intending to continue straight is a well-known FSD beta deficiency.

This wasn't turning into a turning lane; this was automatically changing into the left through lane from the right through lane when there was a left exit lane. I have it set for me to approve all lane changes, and it never automatically changed lanes at any other point during the trip except to take an exit.

 

[JulienW]

This wasn't turning into a turning lane; this was automatically changing into the left through lane from the right through lane when there was a left exit lane. I have it set for me to approve all lane changes, and it never automatically changed lanes at any other point during the trip except to take an exit.

Were you on the Beta Stack or the NoA Stack? If on the Beta Stack then Beta decides and makes all lane changes. If on the NoA Stack then you must confirm.

Also if on a freeway that crosses or near a city street sometimes the Beta Stack will mistakenly take over (and vise versa) for a short period of time.

 

[LincolnsDoctor]

Were you on the Beta Stack or the NoA Stack? If on the Beta Stack then Beta decides and makes all lane changes. If on the NoA Stack then you must confirm.

Also if on a freeway that crosses or near a city street sometimes the Beta Stack will mistakenly take over (and vise versa) for a short period of time.

All behavior except for some automatic lane changes indicate I was on FSD beta. Plus I have never seen or heard of a "moving out of right most lane" message. Very different from my experience with NoA I suppose it is possible it was switching back and forth between the two without realizing it. Is there something that tells you which one is active?

 

[JulienW]

All behavior except for some automatic lane changes indicate I was on FSD beta. Plus I have never seen or heard of a "moving out of right most lane" message. Very different from my experience with NoA I suppose it is possible it was switching back and forth between the two without realizing it. Is there something that tells you which one is active?

The display visualizations switch. If on the Beta Stack then you have NO control over what lane it uses (unless you disengage).

In a nutshell if on a limited access highway it switches to the NoA Stack.
On all other roads it uses the Beta Stack.

 

[LincolnsDoctor]

The display visualizations switch. If on the Beta Stack then you have NO control over what lane it uses (unless you disengage).

In a nutshell if on a limited access highway it switches to the NoA Stack.
On all other roads it uses the Beta Stack.

View attachment 819401

Interesting. It was doing that. What it wasn't doing was automatic speed based lane changes. When it moved into the left lane for no clear reason there were no other cars around, but there was an at grade intersection. Other times when it tried to move into the left lane to maintain the set speed it waited for confirmation. If anyone wants to try using FSD beta on US-15 north between Frederick and DIllsburg maybe they figure out what is happening. 15 is one of those roads that switches from limited access to at grade intersections and back, so maybe that is what was confusing

 

[Supcom]

Interesting. It was doing that. What it wasn't doing was automatic speed based lane changes. When it moved into the left lane for no clear reason there were no other cars around, but there was an at grade intersection. Other times when it tried to move into the left lane to maintain the set speed it waited for confirmation. If anyone wants to try using FSD beta on US-15 north between Frederick and DIllsburg maybe they figure out what is happening. 15 is one of those roads that switches from limited access to at grade intersections and back, so maybe that is what was confusing

FSD beta never asks permission, only forgiveness!

If you were on a highway with speed limit 65 mph, or greater, then you would have been on NOA, which will request permission, depending on your settings.

FSD beta does not necessarily choose lanes based on speed. It's kind of inexplicable in it's selection and sometimes make strange choices.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Tried FSDb (b) on my way home on residential streets, Calle Cristobal to Camino Ruiz, to Capricorn Way. It was predictably unusable on Capricorn Way with speed bumps. It doesn’t respond to requested speed changes nearly soon enough, it doesn’t speed up fast enough, it’s awful with stop signs. And it doesn’t even do chauffeur stops (I confirmed this - it’s not terribly jerky but it is not like just fully regen to a stop in hold mode).

Fails to reposition in lanes when others exhibit poor lane control (doesn’t leave buffers).

Coming to a stop in general is bizarrely jerky. I don’t understand why it has such a hard time just smoothly decelerating from 50mph to 0 with ample warning.

Definitely a lot more pleasant and relaxing to drive myself at this point.

 

[Yelobird]

Tried FSDb (b) on my way home on residential streets, Calle Cristobal to Camino Ruiz, to Capricorn Way. It was predictably unusable on Capricorn Way with speed bumps. It doesn’t respond to requested speed changes nearly soon enough, it doesn’t speed up fast enough, it’s awful with stop signs. And it doesn’t even do chauffeur stops (I confirmed this - it’s not terribly jerky but it is not like just fully regen to a stop in hold mode).

Fails to reposition in lanes when others exhibit poor lane control (doesn’t leave buffers).

Coming to a stop in general is bizarrely jerky. I don’t understand why it has such a hard time just smoothly decelerating from 50mph to 0 with ample warning.

Definitely a lot more pleasant and relaxing to drive myself at this point.

Sorry but based on your posts and definition of “unusable“ your expectations are WAY to high for what this is sorry. If you are looking for “chauffeur stops” and don’t spill my tea smooth take offs you really should opt out and actually get a Chauffeur! Lol. The software will NEVER drive like You! Honestly your extremely specific expectations will Never happen.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Sorry but based on your posts and definition of “unusable“ your expectations are WAY to high for what this is sorry. If you are looking for “chauffeur stops” and don’t spill my tea smooth take offs you really should opt out and actually get a Chauffeur! Lol. The software will NEVER drive like You! Honestly your extremely specific expectations will Never happen.

I’d settle for something remotely resembling normal driving.

The lack of ability to do simple stopping is troublesome. Since Tesla can already do this. You do know Teslas (when Hold Mode stopping is enabled) do chauffeur stops every time without driver input, right? So why can’t FSDb (b)?

To be clear about my expectations: I definitely am not surprised in the least that this is the current state of the product. I expect it to be this way for years. Not my first rodeo.

 

[wknickless]

If on the Beta Stack then you have NO control over what lane it uses (unless you disengage).

I can suppress an FSD Beta lane change by canceling the turn signal.

That gets me a few feet down the road in the appropriate lane on approach to one of the complicated/confusing combined railroad crossing/traffic light intersections on my way to work. Often just one or two signal cancellations is good enough to stay in the lane that eventually splits into two left turn lanes. At that point it figures out the geometry and generally does the right thing.

 

[Yelobird]

I’d settle for something remotely resembling normal driving.

The lack of ability to do simple stopping is troublesome. Since Tesla can already do this. You do know Teslas (when Hold Mode stopping is enabled) do chauffeur stops every time without driver input, right? So why can’t FSDb (b)?

I have done thousands of miles on FSDb and it stops fine with no issue. Does it drive like I drive, no nor do I expect it to. Does that make it “unusable“? No just different. I fully respect posts highlighting legitimate questionable elements of FSDb like lane changes etc but smoothness or jerking wheel? Does it really matter if the wheel shakes In the big picture? Not really. Complaining to simply complain adds little value. If your waiting for it to turn, brake, accelerate like you I am certain you Will be unsatisfied no matter what as that will Never happen.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Does that make it “unusable“? No just different.

I guess I should have just gone with “unpleasant.” It can still be used, but not sure what for, other than for entertainment and novelty (valid reasons).

 

[tmoz]

I guess I should have just gone with “unpleasant.” It can still be used, but not sure what for, other than for entertainment and novelty (valid reasons).

You are posting to a tough audience. After it gets past the part of not trying to kill you or sending your car to the body shop, we can turn to not giving you whiplash. I wonder what grade telsa auto insurance would rate the product at the moment?

 

[Jeff N]

FSD beta does not necessarily choose lanes based on speed. It's kind of inexplicable in it's selection and sometimes make strange choices.

So, just like FSD beta.

 

[black knight 3]

I have done thousands of miles on FSDb and it stops fine with no issue. Does it drive like I drive, no nor do I expect it to. Does that make it “unusable“? No just different. I fully respect posts highlighting legitimate questionable elements of FSDb like lane changes etc but smoothness or jerking wheel? Does it really matter if the wheel shakes In the big picture? Not really. Complaining to simply complain adds little value. If your waiting for it to turn, brake, accelerate like you I am certain you Will be unsatisfied no matter what as that will Never happen.

I have done thousands of miles on FSDb and it stops fine with no issue. Does it drive like I drive, no nor do I expect it to. Does that make it “unusable“? No just different. I fully respect posts highlighting legitimate questionable elements of FSDb like lane changes etc but smoothness or jerking wheel? Does it really matter if the wheel shakes In the big picture? Not really. Complaining to simply complain adds little value. If your waiting for it to turn, brake, accelerate like you I am certain you Will be unsatisfied no matter what as that will Never happen.

I beg to differ on that "never happening". It will happen because perception is every bit as important as reality. FSD is doomed to fail in the marketplace if folks feel uncomfortable and unsafe using it. Tesla is fully aware of that too but their focus at this moment is FSD getting us from point A to point B without intervention. My wife would not feel comfortable at this time with me using FSD and I think the majority of folks feel the same way she does. The beta testing group is more forgiving of FSD beta quirks and obviously is a unique sample set of the user base.

 

[rjack1282]

beta testing group

Exactly. We are a beta testing group and can't expect the software to be "usable" at this point. By "usable" I mean the end goal of FSD. The literal point is for us to use it, test it, and let Tesla collect as much data as possible to continue to improve beta to a point where one day it will be "usable".

 

[sleepydoc]

Exactly. We are a beta testing group and can't expect the software to be "usable" at this point. By "usable" I mean the end goal of FSD. The literal point is for us to use it, test it, and let Tesla collect as much data as possible to continue to improve beta to a point where one day it will be "usable".

Yes! This is FSDb, not FSD. So many people seem to think that passing the ‘safety score test’ and getting the FSDb download is simply early access. It’s not. It’s being allowed to use the software for the purpose of testing it and uncovering bugs so the programming team can improve it with the eventual goal of making it stable enough for wider release. If you don’t understand that the. You shouldn’t use the software. See this thread: FSD Beta Experience - Be Careful What You Wish For

I guess I should have just gone with “unpleasant.” It can still be used, but not sure what for, other than for entertainment and novelty (valid reasons).

See above and read the linked thread. The entire purpose of being a beta tester is just that, to test beta software. From your posts it sounds like you misunderstood that and had the wrong expectations.

 

[dramsey]

I haven’t noticed that when another car is actually present but I do notice shallow turns when there is no adjacent car in the street I am turning into. As in, I allow FSD to make those turns with an adjacent car present and it doesn’t actually crash into it. It may well make some awkward steering adjustments through the turn.

This has been my experience as well. The car cuts corners more than I'd like when no cars are present, but "swerves" around them when they are present at the corner.

 

[Jmolloy3]

Some of the capabilities are pretty miraculous, considering that this is all "vision". However, I've had most of the aberrant issues listed above too. I worry that a lot of the issues, particularly UPLs, are caused by the B-pillar camera locations, and some calculation latency. I don't see a solution w/o forward, side viewing camera locations (on A-pillars maybe), and/or HW4. In the mean time, it's pretty fun to use, as long as you don't have unrealistic expectations.