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FSD Beta 10.69

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Possible method to get beta 10.69.2.3 update sooner.
I've never seen this work in the past but after seeing the James Locke tweet below I immediately went to the vehicle software page and it actually worked. The update to 10.69.2.3 (2022.20.18) started within about 30 seconds...amazing!

View attachment 861467
Appeared to work for me too. Not 30 seconds though, at which point I gave up, but ~ an hour later it had downloaded.

I suppose it could be coincidence....

Thanks n.one.one!

p.s. Update done. Fun to see my install show up on TeslaFi fleet software tracker! Now it is time to go for a drive!

SW
 
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It worked for me as well on our MX and our MS. Thank you James!!!😁
Going to the software screen, worked for me also. Stopped at 50% for 15 minutes. Was it doing a checksum? Took it for a drive. Seems a little bit better. Still makes mistakes every half mile.
  1. Wrong speed limit, often too fast, doesn't read speed limit signs. In my residential neighborhood with private streets it thinks the speed limit is 25 when it is 15.
  2. Very poor lane choices. Wants to be in the left lane when right turn coming up. Wants to be in the right lane when left turn coming up.
  3. Plenty of jerk. Where it use to jerk heavily before it jerks less now, but did have a new occurrence of jerk where it didn't happen before. On a residential street, I was lowering speed to 25 mph, suddenly car accelerates hard to 27 mph, then slows down rapidly.
  4. Races towards red lights. Why can't it see the red light coming up and slow down sooner?
  5. Generally speaking, and I suspect I'm in the minority opinion, car is too heavy on the g forces. I wish it would drive much smoother. Slow down sooner for stop signs and accelerate slower. Acceleration seems better with this version.
  6. Navigation route is poor. Likes to take routes with speed bumps which I avoid.
  7. On a residential street with good visibility and no traffic, for an unprotected left turn: car will slow down to almost a stop then makes a left turn then accelerate. Most people just take a smooth left turn.
In terms of being ready for taxi service, one can look at it in terms of serious errors. I haven't noticed any very serious errors except for stopping on the on ramp to the freeway with previous version. Another concern is lack of pothole avoidance. Driverless taxis aren't going to last long running over every pothole over and over again.
I was very negative on FSD prior to this update. After this update I'm more optimistic. Not sure why that is. Perhaps because I'm understanding it better.
 
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Strangely enough, I had noticed that bit about checking the software screen for updates literally years ago. Depending upon the mood, I do it once a day or once a week, more often when there's an update in the offing. And if an update appears on its own, well, it appears on its own.

The 69.2.3 release appeared on its own; the 69.2.2 was found by checking.
 
Going to the software screen, worked for me also. Stopped at 50% for 15 minutes. Was it doing a checksum? Took it for a drive. Seems a little bit better. Still makes mistakes every half mile.
  1. Wrong speed limit, often too fast, doesn't read speed limit signs. In my residential neighborhood with private streets it thinks the speed limit is 25 when it is 15.
  2. Very poor lane choices. Wants to be in the left lane when right turn coming up. Wants to be in the right lane when left turn coming up.
  3. Plenty of jerk. Where it use to jerk heavily before it jerks less now, but did have a new occurrence of jerk where it didn't happen before. On a residential street, I was lowering speed to 25 mph, suddenly car accelerates hard to 27 mph, then slows down rapidly.
  4. Races towards red lights. Why can't it see the red light coming up and slow down sooner?
  5. Generally speaking, and I suspect I'm in the minority opinion, car is too heavy on the g forces. I wish it would drive much smoother. Slow down sooner for stop signs and accelerate slower. Acceleration seems better with this version.
  6. Navigation route is poor. Likes to take routes with speed bumps which I avoid.
  7. On a residential street with good visibility and no traffic, for an unprotected left turn: car will slow down to almost a stop then makes a left turn then accelerate. Most people just take a smooth left turn.
In terms of being ready for taxi service, one can look at it in terms of serious errors. I haven't noticed any very serious errors except for stopping on the on ramp to the freeway with previous version. Another concern is lack of pothole avoidance. Driverless taxis aren't going to last long running over every pothole over and over again.
I was very negative on FSD prior to this update. After this update I'm more optimistic. Not sure why that is. Perhaps because I'm understanding it better.
Agree with all of the above. Roundabouts still non-functional for me. Entering roundabout for third exit, it totally stopped for southbound vehicle still 25 yards outside roundabout. Nearly rear-ended by car following me through roundabout. Ignores dips in road as well as speed bumps. Hitting speed bump at 30 mph with heavy MX is actually quite exciting!😂🤣 I will stick with it, however….
 
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I don’t work in software but I think I remember them mentioning in some presentation that FSD is capable of depth perception using some algorithm my monkey brain will never be able to understand.
they can do statistical estimates based on knowledge of common sizes of typically observed objects, but that works for common things, plus motion based estimations. But the rare tail cases are one that matter and they violate statistical assumptions. Or it's using a huge computational burden to get at something which could be obtained far more economically, letting the computational budget be used for other important things.

Humans use stereoscopic vision as well as subtle autofocusing signals, which is how a one-eyed friend said he did depth perception. Neither of these are available on a Tesla. But Subaru has been doing stereo, without lidar or radar, for decades now and people think its system performs well. With an artificial system you can have cameras more widely spaced than human eyes, giving superhuman performance, i.e. parallax out to longer distances.


Subaru doesn't have the machine learning capability of Tesla, so their high performance probably comes from the right hardware sensors. With better ML and sensors, Tesla could do better still. Tesla is excellent vs competitors in lane keeping (steering control) as that's a ML-first problem, but performs less well in longitudinal speed control where physical distances & velocities and classifications of obstruction are primary.

I agree with not using lidar on a consumer purchased vehicle, too expensive and fragile and with a high power cost for enough performance. I think the lack of stereo (as well as lack of full all around camera coverage) is a significant deficiency which would improve performance at a low cost.

If every car had direct physical distance determination at shorter distances, this would also provide an enormous potential dataset for autolabeling (as they reverse time and see what objects were in the distance some seconds earlier). Tesla has some instrumented cars with radar or lidar probably to generate training sets but not a full fleet.
 
they can do statistical estimates based on knowledge of common sizes of typically observed objects, but that works for common things, plus motion based estimations. But the rare tail cases are one that matter and they violate statistical assumptions. Or it's using a huge computational burden to get at something which could be obtained far more economically, letting the computational budget be used for other important things.

Humans use stereoscopic vision as well as subtle autofocusing signals, which is how a one-eyed friend said he did depth perception. Neither of these are available on a Tesla. But Subaru has been doing stereo, without lidar or radar, for decades now and people think its system performs well. With an artificial system you can have cameras more widely spaced than human eyes, giving superhuman performance, i.e. parallax out to longer distances.


Subaru doesn't have the machine learning capability of Tesla, so their high performance probably comes from the right hardware sensors. With better ML and sensors, Tesla could do better still. Tesla is excellent vs competitors in lane keeping (steering control) as that's a ML-first problem, but performs less well in longitudinal speed control where physical distances & velocities and classifications of obstruction are primary.

I agree with not using lidar on a consumer purchased vehicle, too expensive and fragile and with a high power cost for enough performance. I think the lack of stereo (as well as lack of full all around camera coverage) is a significant deficiency which would improve performance at a low cost.

If every car had direct physical distance determination at shorter distances, this would also provide an enormous potential dataset for autolabeling (as they reverse time and see what objects were in the distance some seconds earlier). Tesla has some instrumented cars with radar or lidar probably to generate training sets but not a full fleet.
Tesla has changed cameras in the past to get us to where we are today with three forward looking cameras. It seems trivial and inexpensive to add one more camera up front for stereo vision. However, Tesla hasn't done it for years. What does Tesla know that we don't?
 
Almost every concern about Tesla's sensor suite has dwindled over time.

My main concern is HW3. At this point, it doesn't seem good enough for generalized robotaxis. It might get good enough for some routes or areas but not what Elon has been saying.
 
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Almost every concern about Tesla's sensor suite has dwindled over time.

My main concern is HW3. At this point, it doesn't seem good enough for generalized robotaxis. It might get good enough for some routes or areas but not what Elon has been saying.
I don’t quite understand what you’re saying? That there are no concerns over the sensor suite, and your only concern is the FSD computer?

I feel like the sensor suite has been very well documented to have a bunch of issues. blind spots for unprotected turns (B pillar camera placement), limited distance due to low resolution, and getting blinded by direct sunlight and rain.
 
Tesla has changed cameras in the past to get us to where we are today with three forward looking cameras. It seems trivial and inexpensive to add one more camera up front for stereo vision. However, Tesla hasn't done it for years.

When the sensor set was designed it included a radar. I had presumed they would continue to increase the resolution and capability of that radar but they did not.
What does Tesla know that we don't?
It's run by one person's opinions which are formed extremely quickly and increasingly little introspection or willing to listen to considerations. They took out a cheap rain sensor, and it still works worse. There isn't even camera coverage 360 degrees around (e.g. for top down view for parking) even though most competition does have it. Radar taken out long long before vision performance was adequate to replace.

That same CEO is obsessed with improving financial margins (he is personally highly leveraged) and rarely agrees to anything that requires any sort of redesign or increased cost, particularly anything that might require them to pay for retrofit for promised "FSD hardware" to people who have already purchased it.

I don't see much directional change in improving the sensors, and usually the reverse, unlike many other areas of the car where there are continuous internal improvements. Motors and software are better, they went to a heat pump and a lithium ion accessory battery (though there was a high service cost for the lead acid).

In a nutshell, Elon thinks he's a genius on ML and FSD but he's really wrong there and way out of his depth. He does what he claims shouldn't be done: "reasoning by analogy".
 
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car is too heavy on the g forces. I wish it would drive much smoother. Slow down sooner for stop signs and accelerate slower. Acceleration seems better with this version.
It actually has a lot of room to accelerate more briskly with no complaints from people. It just needs to do it with less jerk, and in the appropriate contexts. People would be so happy.
 
It actually has a lot of room to accelerate more briskly with no complaints from people. It just needs to do it with less jerk, and in the appropriate contexts. People would be so happy.

One thing that I saw on NoA (not FSD beta) is that when it slows down for curves it changes the max speed limit in increments of 5 miles per hour. After each one of these there is a significant deceleration and then coast. Too much fluctuation in acceleration and that's whats felt by human proprioception.

That's undesirable and obviously not human like behavior.
 
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One thing that I saw on NoA (not FSD beta) is that when it slows down for curves it changes the max speed limit in increments of 5 miles per hour. After each one of these there is a significant deceleration and then coast. Too much fluctuation in acceleration and that's whats felt by human proprioception.

That's undesirable and obviously not human like behavior.
Yep; a human decelerates potentially just as much, but more gradually (meaning they phase in the deceleration, possibly even attaining a higher peak deceleration than NoA, and also phase it out, gradually).
 
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I don’t quite understand what you’re saying? That there are no concerns over the sensor suite, and your only concern is the FSD computer?

I feel like the sensor suite has been very well documented to have a bunch of issues. blind spots for unprotected turns (B pillar camera placement), limited distance due to low resolution, and getting blinded by direct sunlight and rain.

Blind spots are solved with software, creeping techniques and whatnot. If humans can deal with blind spots, so can fsd, with the right software. There are many instances where I am totally blind in a certain direction, but I can still manage by creeping out slowly, hoping whoever will stop for me, if not, I back in again.

Getting blinded by sunlight or rain: this will be an issue regardless of how many cameras you have.
 
Going to the software screen, worked for me also. Stopped at 50% for 15 minutes. Was it doing a checksum? Took it for a drive. Seems a little bit better. Still makes mistakes every half mile.
  1. Wrong speed limit, often too fast, doesn't read speed limit signs. In my residential neighborhood with private streets it thinks the speed limit is 25 when it is 15.
  2. Very poor lane choices. Wants to be in the left lane when right turn coming up. Wants to be in the right lane when left turn coming up.
  3. Plenty of jerk. Where it use to jerk heavily before it jerks less now, but did have a new occurrence of jerk where it didn't happen before. On a residential street, I was lowering speed to 25 mph, suddenly car accelerates hard to 27 mph, then slows down rapidly.
  4. Races towards red lights. Why can't it see the red light coming up and slow down sooner?
  5. Generally speaking, and I suspect I'm in the minority opinion, car is too heavy on the g forces. I wish it would drive much smoother. Slow down sooner for stop signs and accelerate slower. Acceleration seems better with this version.
  6. Navigation route is poor. Likes to take routes with speed bumps which I avoid.
  7. On a residential street with good visibility and no traffic, for an unprotected left turn: car will slow down to almost a stop then makes a left turn then accelerate. Most people just take a smooth left turn.
In terms of being ready for taxi service, one can look at it in terms of serious errors. I haven't noticed any very serious errors except for stopping on the on ramp to the freeway with previous version. Another concern is lack of pothole avoidance. Driverless taxis aren't going to last long running over every pothole over and over again.
I was very negative on FSD prior to this update. After this update I'm more optimistic. Not sure why that is. Perhaps because I'm understanding it better.
Slow down sooner for stop signs?! Mine abruptly goes from 45 down to 10 like 300-400 feet from the stop sign and then drives at like 10 mph toward it from a distance. It’s super bizarre and pisses off anyone behind me so I have to frequently disengage if anyone is behind me.

Fsd needs to be trained how to use regen braking to slow smoothly to a stop at the right distance like an experienced tesla driver can do.
 
Blind spots are solved with software, creeping techniques and whatnot. If humans can deal with blind spots, so can fsd, with the right software. There are many instances where I am totally blind in a certain direction, but I can still manage by creeping out slowly, hoping whoever will stop for me, if not, I back in again.
No not exactly. Your head is far ahead of the B pillar camera. You can peak out before the B pillar camera can, so FSD needs to creep out further than a human does.
Getting blinded by sunlight or rain: this will be an issue regardless of how many cameras you have.
Exactly…so the sensor suite is insufficient…
 
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