mknox
Well-Known Member
"Hill Assist" sounds to me like something to help you get up a hill. Maybe "Timed Hill Hold Assist"? :wink:
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Firmware 6.2
- Thread starter spentan
- Start date
"Hill Assist" sounds to me like something to help you get up a hill. Maybe "Timed Hill Hold Assist"? :wink:
tinm
2020 Model S LR+ Owner
Turns out it is new firmware, something past .21. Service center says it's minor bug fixes.
Hm... "get up" vs. "not fall down backwards". Tomato, tomato.
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MarcG
Active Member
I don't think it SHOULD hold in the direction of travel. If I'm in D on a downhill and I release the brake pedal, I would want the car to start moving forward, not stay stationary!
My first electric car (Fiat 500e) DID hold in this situation and it drove me nuts, especially in the hilly streets of San Francisco. Sure, I could disable hill assist altogether, but then it wouldn't hold if I was facing UPhill and in D, which is critical.
I personally believe the way Tesla implemented it IS perfect. That is, hold only if releasing the brake pedal would otherwise let gravity move the car in the opposite direction of gear selection (in D on an uphill, or in R on a downhill).
Otherwise, do NOT hold if releasing the brake pedal lets gravity move the car in the SAME direction of gear selection (in D on a downhill, or in R on an uphill).
SteveS0353
Member
Yes, I agree. My "not perfect" comment was not related to concept of operation, but the sensitivity to the incline. On rather shallow inclines, I've found the hill assist will not hold, but it's not a huge issue since the car only begins to move slowly on a shallow incline. I think the concept of operation (gravity acting in the opposite direction to the gear selection) is perfect.
Forty Creek
Member
MarcG
Active Member
Ah yes, thanks for the clarification. Agreed that it's not perfect in that low inclines don't always trigger hill hold.
I completely agree with you about not wanting hill hold in the direction of travel. That's what the brake does. I wouldn't want to have to accelerate to release a hold in the direction I am travelling - the thought of accelerating downhill into a car not far away in order to release the brake is frightening!
Cyclone
Cyclonic Member ((.oO))
While I am personally ambivalent to hill hold/assist applying to the direction of travel, I am surprised to see comments and people strongly feeling it shouldn't. Is it that big of a deal if, facing downhill in Drive, if the car continues to brake for 1 second after you physically let go of the breaks? All Tesla's implementation of hill hold/assist is doing is adding in a delay before the vehicle starts moving. I would have thought this would just fly off everyone's back.
But it just goes to show you that everyone has different desire, expectations, behaviors and having the choice on how these things apply opens up the possibilities for everyone.
jvonbokel
John VonBokel
Agreed. I'd actually ideally prefer a sort of "anti-creep" mode, where the car stays put *indefinitely* upon release of the brake pedal at a standstill, regardless of slope or direction. I don't know if that's even feasible, but I get the impression I'd be a very small minority if I requested that.
Thats the way hill hold assist worked on both of mye previous cars when activated. You had to touch the accelerator pedal to release it. Worked like a charm both for manual gearbox and automatic. Havent really noticed a difference on my car now more than maybe 1-2times with a foot or twoo backwards roll.
Previous cars were an Audi A5(manual) and a VW Tiguan(DSG) so both VAG-cars.
MarcG
Active Member
Yes, it's a HUGE deal actually. It's much easier AND safer to feather the brake pedal when trying to slowly move forward while in D on a steep downhill, than go back-and-forth between the brake pedal and the accelerator to make small movements.
If you came out to hilly San Francisco, I'd love to show you what I mean. I still have a friend who has the 500e, which has the hill-hold-in-both-directions behavior.
Todd Burch
14-Year Member
Yes, and yes. Better approach is to pull the stalk to continue when the car in front starts again, versus pressing the pedal. It's easier and safer, IMHO.
I haven't used the hill hold yet, but the TACC hold definitely uses the friction brakes. You can even see the pedal move. It will hold indefinitely on a flat or sloped (either direction) until the accel is tapped or the stalk is pulled. It would be nice if hill hold worked like that, clearly the hardware (and software) can do it.
Lex
Member
Thanks I had been wanting to find out how much TACC is using the brakes. I get a lot of brake dust on the wheels for the amount I use them and I've suspected the robot is causing most of my scrubbing work. Ah well can't have everything I guess lol
I can't wait to see it slam on the brake pedal (but a little pressure goes a long way with these brakes so I guess I don't expect to see too much pedal travel when I look). I already know just how much it uses the brakes, and that is way more than I do. Though TACC is a sanity saver in the stop-and-go highway nonsense I'm involved in, it's not totally without its own nonsense.
As for hill hold, I'd prefer the option to turn it off completely as I've got swell response rates (for now anyway ; ) and worst case, 2 feet... but I do see how it is safer and better on energy consumption.
Andyw2100
Well-Known Member
I think what Cyclone was getting at was "Is the 1 second delay before the brake is released" really that big a deal?
Clearly what you are saying, MarcG, makes a lot of sense. But if Hill Hold Assist works as I think it does, and were to work in the direction of the active gear too the way people are suggesting it might, presumably once you eased off the brake pedal some, there would be a 1 (or 2) second delay before your car started moving, but then everything would be exactly the same as it is now. The only time the 1 (or 2) second delay would come into play again would be if you brought the car to a complete stop with the brake pedal. I don't think Cyclone was envisioning your needing to alternate between the accelerator and the brake pedal. At least when I read his post, I wasn't envisioning that.
Cyclone
Cyclonic Member ((.oO))
MarcG
Active Member
The bolded part would annoy the hell out of me. That's what the 500e did and I really disliked it. I'm very glad the Model S doesn't behave that way!
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