FSD Beta 10.69

[Dewg]

I wonder if it got couldn’t identify it since it didn’t fit the recognition criteria for a car or a motorcycle and it ended up going to ‘nothing?’

This isn’t desirable but it’s the kind of thing that happens when your algorithm that works fine when you test it meets the real world with things you didn’t consider in your testing.

The thing I'm interested in is the new ON - when the car showed nothing, did it at least show a grey "blob", meaning not drivable space?

 

[buyleonard]

The thing I'm interested in is the new ON - when the car showed nothing, did it at least show a grey "blob", meaning not drivable space?

No, it showed car, then motorcycle, then nothing (no blob). And then kept flipping between them. I followed it for a while on the Freeway, and it was fine, and it was fine on the exit ramp until it moved to the left of the lane. Then it started messing up.

 

[Dewg]

No, it showed car, then motorcycle, then nothing (no blob). And then kept flipping between them. I followed it for a while on the Freeway, and it was fine, and it was fine on the exit ramp until it moved to the left of the lane. Then it started messing up.

Could it be a camera calibration issue on the left?

 

[generalmilk]

It stopped with the front of the car in the intersection. I could either back up or go. I decided to go. Maybe I should have backed up, it was a split second decision.

Now it is clear. So car did enter the intersection improperly.

 

[ironwill96]

I have had really good experiences with .2.3 here are the issues I have experienced

Right after we leave our house we drive 3 house to a 4 way stop. Have to take a left to exit subdivision. Even with no other cars present this left is the most tentative jittery left that FSD does. Just plain weird. It should be quick stop and just go with no one else around. Instead it waits to long then while turning will stop and go and stop and go. Nothing at all on any of the corners to block view.

Sometimes when preparing to take a left turn the car will start to go right before correcting and moving into left turn lane. Only moves a foot or two to the right before correcting and heading to left hand turn lane.

Sometimes accelerates to quickly after taking left especially when pulling into parking lot.

Annoys my wife when we come to four way stop and it comes to complete stop and pauses before continuing. Yup those 2 seconds she will never get back.

My wife also was annoyed at four way stop behavior. I told her yeah the government made them actually follow the laws and won’t allow rolling stops even though every human being does it, especially when there are clear sight lines and you know nobody is coming.

 

[JulienW]

.... I was following behind a 3-wheel car, and we were slowing down to a stop after exiting the Freeway (so FSD Beta was engaged). The 3-wheel moved to the left side of the lane, and FSD acted as if it wasn't there and looked like it would have hit it if I hadn't stepped on the brakes. After hitting the brakes, I noticed the display of the 3-wheel car kept switching from a car, to a motorcycle, then to nothing, and then repeating. I took an Autopilot Snapshot and a Dashcam recording.

Of course needs more work but keep in mind that there is no such thing as a 3-wheeled car. So you are saying the FSD is confusing the 2 but so are you (and many others including media). This is a autocycle or called just a vehicle by many manufactures. Also they can be from a near stripped down open "motorcycle" type to a full inclosed cabin. This is why the display is changing back and forth.

Also just because it is not display doesn't mean it will hit it. The occupancy network is looking to avoid all kinds of obstacles that are not displayed. It sees it even if it can't classify it and match to the internal database to render it properly since it doesn't have a rendering for it.

 

[sleepydoc]

Of course needs more work but keep in mind that there is no such thing as a 3-wheeled car. So you are saying the FSD is confusing the 2 but so are you (and many others including media). This is a autocycle or called just a vehicle by many manufactures. Also they can be from a near stripped down open "motorcycle" type to a full inclosed cabin. This is why the display is changing back and forth.

Also just because it is not display doesn't mean it will hit it. The occupancy network is looking to avoid all kinds of obstacles that are not displayed. It sees it even if it can't classify it and match to the internal database to render it properly since it doesn't have a rendering for it.

 

[kabin]

Yesterday a 3 wheeled trike passed me and was displayed as a large furniture moving truck. Not the type with Ford E-450 van cab either rather one of those Freightliner big boy cabs with no where near the same dimensions as the trike.

 

[PACEMD]

Well, at least it's not still showing every out-of-car experience as a three-wheel garbage can...........

 

[Knightshade]

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Not sure what you think those pics are for? Anything less than 4 wheels is a motorcycle- legally- in the US anyway.

 

[archae86]

Not sure what you think those pics are for? None of those are cars.... Anything less than 4 wheels is a motorcycle- legally- in the US anyway.

Actually many BMW Isettas are 4-wheeled. The two rear wheels are very close together, which avoided the provision of a differential. It was a relentlessly cost-reduced design. Just to make things confusing, some Isettas were 3-wheeled. Someone who owned an Isetta in immaculate condition occasionally drove it to work and parked in the garage at Intel here in Albuquerque about 20 years ago.

 

[thewishmaster]

Not sure what you think those pics are for? None of those are cars.... Anything less than 4 wheels is a motorcycle- legally- in the US anyway.

That last one is definitely a motorcycle. Saw one for the first time the other weekend and it had motorcycle plates. I’m sure FSDb would classify it as a car though due to its size. 3-wheeled meter maid vehicles they use here are definitely marked as cars as of 10.69.2.3 at least.

 

[Knightshade]

Actually many BMW Isettas are 4-wheeled. The two rear wheels are very close together, which avoided the provision of a differential. It was a relentlessly cost-reduced design. Just to make things confusing, some Isettas were 3-wheeled. Someone who owned an Isetta in immaculate condition occasionally drove it to work and parked in the garage at Intel here in Albuquerque about 20 years ago.

Sure- the but one in that picture isn't one of them.

The rear wheels (one of them anyway) would be visible if it was a 4 wheel version, even with the narrow track.

 

[JulienW]

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Vehicles but NOT cars.

 

[Silicon Desert]

My wife also was annoyed at four way stop behavior. I told her yeah the government made them actually follow the laws and won’t allow rolling stops even though every human being does it, especially when there are clear sight lines and you know nobody is coming.

Well now, I wouldn't say every human being does it. It don't. The wife doesn't, but yea, I see people not stopping all the time at stop signs. While I am on the subject, I recall from LONG ago that my English teacher (very picky about grammar of course), said there is no such thing as a "rolling stop". The car is either rolling or it is stopped. She always called it "failure to stop at a sign". I guess I should be happy to not get any more "C" grades for my English Bottom line is we like the fact that the car now fully stops, but I guess we are in the minority.

 

[Silicon Desert]

Is there any likelihood that FSD can "learn" where certain areas are next to home or other remembered location where it can gear down to something more like 10 mph, that way I dont have to intervene?

Same as you, I don't like going 25 in a neighborhood as too many times a kid or critter runs into the street.

However, on your other point above, you reminded me of an opposite situation I have seen starting with the .69 FSD beta updates: There are several places in town where there is a road going alongside a neighborhood (often without houses) that the speed limit is actually 45-55 mph, but now the car thinks it is still 25. In past software versions it got that right, but now it is annoying. In particular there is one very long stretch of road near my house that is at least 3 miles long and the car wants to go 25 on that road. There is nothing out there but tumbleweed

 

[sleepydoc]

Not sure what you think those pics are for? Anything less than 4 wheels is a motorcycle- legally- in the US anyway.

mo·tor·cy·cle ˈmō-tər-ˌsī-kəl

: an automotive vehicle with two in-line wheels

Definition of MOTORCYCLE

an automotive vehicle with two in-line wheels… See the full definition

www.merriam-webster.com

 

[sleepydoc]

Vehicles but NOT cars.

It depends on your definition. What makes a ‘car?’ 4 wheels? Does that classify an ATV as a car, then?

My point is simply that there are vehicles that fall in between traditional definitions. The slingshot (last picture I posted) is probably most accurately described as a glorified motorcycle (although it fails the linguistic definition of a motorcycle.) The others are less clear. As @archae86 said, if you have two wheels on an Isetta, does that suddenly make it a car instead of a motorcycle?

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Rewatching the AI Day 2022 and reexamining the release notes, I believe the "language component" was introduced with 10.11:

Maybe, but I still tend to think it is not. Just the language in the release notes is not what I would expect from the AI Day presentation.

I think the additions in March were a different iteration of perhaps the same sort of thing, though.

Hard to know for sure - in future release notes we may find out whether or not it was included already.

Really difficult to tell without explicit matching language what is actually in the released beta.

 

[JulienW]

It depends on your definition. What makes a ‘car?’ 4 wheels? Does that classify an ATV as a car, then?

My point is simply that there are vehicles that fall in between traditional definitions. The slingshot (last picture I posted) is probably most accurately described as a glorified motorcycle (although it fails the linguistic definition of a motorcycle.) The others are less clear. As @archae86 said, if you have two wheels on an Isetta, does that suddenly make it a car instead of a motorcycle?

You may call a rose whatever you want but what a car is doesn't depend on a subjective definition. Cars also have to meet certain Safety Standards like having Seatbelts, Air Bags and must be Crash Tested and fuel Economy Tested. Autocycles don't.