FSD Beta v11.x

The next big milestone for FSD is 11. It is a significant upgrade and fundamental changes to several parts of the FSD stack including totally new way to train the perception NN.

From AI day and Lex Fridman interview we have a good sense of what might be included.

- Object permanence both temporal and spatial
- Moving from “bag of points” to objects in NN
- Creating a 3D vector representation of the environment all in NN
- Planner optimization using NN / Monte Carlo Tree Search (MCTS)
- Change from processed images to “photon count” / raw image
- Change from single image perception to surround video
- Merging of city, highway and parking lot stacks a.k.a. Single Stack

Lex Fridman Interview of Elon. Starting with FSD related topics.

Here is a detailed explanation of Beta 11 in "layman's language" by James Douma, interview done after Lex Podcast.

Here is the AI Day explanation by in 4 parts.

Deep Understanding Tesla FSD Part 1: HydraNet

From Theory to Reality, Analyze the Evolution of Tesla Full Self-Driving

saneryee-studio.medium.com

Here is a useful blog post asking a few questions to Tesla about AI day. The useful part comes in comparison of Tesla's methods with Waymo and others (detailed papers linked).

Twelve Questions about Tesla Autopilot Technologies Exposed at 2021 AI Day

On Aug. 19 2021, Telsa held an AI day , exposing more technologies about Autopilot , from perception, planning, data labeling, simulation…

yuhuang-63908.medium.com

 

[Pdubs]

I am high on life. Well… okay… and maybe a little bit of scotch.

Yeah. We’ll go with that. Im thinking it was a tad more “enhanced”, while you were watching Monty Python.

 

[PR0FESSOR]

LOL. I swear that there is some special relationship between engineers and Monty Python films. Search for the Holy Grail is my favorite, and the Meaning of Life comes in a close second.

Yeah. We’ll go with that. Im thinking it was a tad more “enhanced”, while you were watching Monty Python.

 

[FSDtester#1]

LOL. I swear that there is some special relationship between engineers and Monty Python films. Search for the Holy Grail is my favorite, and the Meaning of Life comes in a close second.

I forgot the sequence, but yes, they love Monty Python.
There are Easter eggs for them. Just Google it, I have before and it works.

Tesla added a farting Monty Python Easter egg in its newest software update

Tesla CEO Elon Musk has an ongoing love affair with pop culture. Most specifically, memes, Spaceballs and of course Monty Python, who is the subject of Musk’s most recent Tesla Easter Egg. However, the secret feature requires some customization from the user before showing itself. The Easter Egg...

www.teslarati.com

There is the link for one of them, there are more

Not technically a Python film, but loved Yellowbeard, which featured a bunch of the crew.

 

[Keninblaine]

Reading this thread makes me feel thankful for not having spent a ton of money on a feature that Musk has over-promised for many years, and appears to be still years away from being very useful based on the latest "improvements".

 

[pimfram]

Rural driving to my cabin. Car continually tried to drive into turn lanes. They were properly striped with broken lines indicitive of a lane and the straight lane had the proper solid lines. Makes no sense to me.

 

[sleepydoc]

I have found, and posted here, that FSDb actually drives quite well with no destination, and it solves certain problems, particularly the sometimes false " Changing Lanes to Follow Route". It also seems to reduce, but not eliminate, the noted tendency to interpret a turn lane as a new through lane that it should follow.

I actually don't use this mode a lot but it behaves well when I do.

See my comments in this recent post, 3rd paragraph on:

FSD Beta v11.x

The next big milestone for FSD is 11. It is a significant upgrade and fundamental changes to several parts of the FSD stack including totally new way to train the perception NN. From AI day and Lex Fridman interview we have a good sense of what might be included. - Object permanence both...

teslamotorsclub.com

ok - I haven't noticed that but I also haven't used FSD without directions much. Still, if you use FSD without a destination, you can't complain if it goes to one you don't like!

 

[sleepydoc]

Ok, the new light shows are pretty cool, being Christmas and all, but what about those walk-away noises/actions? Elon Twitter-Promised we would get live effects, actions with those noises, like smells with the goats, farts, and ducks, at the least..........maybe a little head butting, wing flapping, brown stains? Sky's the limit you know.........

If you want your car to smell like a barnyard all you have to do is let your teenage son drive it for a week...

 

[hybridbear]

Wipers are still trash. Today is our first cloudy day since the update & they were dry wiping like crazy. Fortunately since we have an older S we can turn them off even while using FSD Beta.

 

[TK211X]

I reinstalled the software and cleared the camera calibration. Soft reset after that and I no longer get visualization stutter randomly. May be a good idea to do it just in case if you haven’t.

There was for sure something wacky with this update going on.

 

[Knightshade]

Reading this thread makes me feel thankful for not having spent a ton of money on a feature that Musk has over-promised for many years, and appears to be still years away from being very useful based on the latest "improvements".

FWIW I've used FSDb for like 95%+ of my actual minutes of driving for many thousands of miles now... yes it's not safe/usable for the other few percent of the time-but if you're paying attention (which you should be) it's not a problem... and acts as a huge reduction of stress/effort the other 95%+ of the time. On top of that after not too long you learn ahead of time where the few-percent-of-failures are likely to be on any locations you frequently drive so you already know to work around em.

For me it's certainly NOT a robotaxi, but it's a pretty good L2 ADAS.

Some other folks appear to have either vastly less success (I see frequent suggestion S/X has a bigger issue than 3/Y) or they're in the bucket of the guy who stopped using it 100% of the time because it fails to do one single turn on his drive properly.

 

[Twiglett]

FWIW I've used FSDb for like 95%+ of my actual minutes of driving for many thousands of miles now... yes it's not safe/usable for the other few percent of the time-but if you're paying attention (which you should be) it's not a problem... and acts as a huge reduction of stress/effort the other 95%+ of the time. On top of that after not too long you learn ahead of time where the few-percent-of-failures are likely to be on any locations you frequently drive so you already know to work around em.

For me it's certainly NOT a robotaxi, but it's a pretty good L2 ADAS.

Some other folks appear to have either vastly less success (I see frequent suggestion S/X has a bigger issue than 3/Y) or they're in the bucket of the guy who stopped using it 100% of the time because it fails to do one single turn on his drive properly.

fully agree with this. Vast majority of the time FSDb does a pretty good job and sometimes it loses its marbles - which I am there to prevent.
The worst it feels like is an uncomfortable lurch to one side.
Sure, if I ignore it and don't take over the car would cause an accident, but I know I'm the driver and have full control, so nothing happens.
So my commute is completely stress free while I monitor FSD.

 

[Yelobird]

fully agree with this. Vast majority of the time FSDb does a pretty good job and sometimes it loses its marbles - which I am there to prevent.
The worst it feels like is an uncomfortable lurch to one side.
Sure, if I ignore it and don't take over the car would cause an accident, but I know I'm the driver and have full control, so nothing happens.
So my commute is completely stress free while I monitor FSD.

Fully agreed granted I think “would” should be “could”.

 

[S100D]

Why are you using FSD with no destination? That’s the equivalent of getting into a cab and saying ‘just drive’ then getting annoyed when the driver makes a turn you don’t like. This isn’t a fault in FSD, it‘s a fault with how you’re using it.

I had the same FSD problem on my 2016 Model S90D and only check it on new firmware/map releases to see if Tesla fixed the issue. I understand that you should put in a destination when using FSD, but if there is no destination set, FSD should follow the lane lines and not make any turns since there is no destination to tell FSD to turn right or left to reach the destination.

The street that I test it on is Jester Blvd., it has a few curves and it is about 1.5 miles long. FSD should follow the lane lines for the entire 1.5 miles. Instead of doing this, about .4 miles into the drive, it will turn on the right blinker, make a right turn and follow a loop around to a stop sign at Jester Blvd. Since there is no destination, instead of turning right on Jester Blvd., it crosses Jester Blvd. and winds through other streets. If I cancel FSD and not let it turn right, it will go up a few blocks and turn on the left blinker and want to make a left turn. If I cancel FSD and let it continue, it will try and turn right into the neighborhood pool parking lot. If I cancel it, it will then go up a few more streets and try and make left turn. This has happened on multiple firmware and map updates. Since it happens on the same streets and pool parking lot, there is an issue with either FSD or map software.

 

[MP3Mike]

but if there is no destination set, FSD should follow the lane lines and not make any turns since there is no destination to tell FSD to turn right or left to reach the destination.

I'd say the main issue is your expectation of how it should work, as Tesla certainly hasn't said that without a destination set that it will just go straight.

Since it happens on the same streets and pool parking lot, there is an issue with either FSD or map software.

There is no issue. I think Elon said that it tries to head towards "home" if you don't have a destination set. (Or maybe it decides on heading toward home, or work, based on time of day or distance from either.) My experience has been that it mainly goes straight until it can't and then it normally turns right if it can. But it isn't consistent.

If you want a predictable travel path set a destination. (Setting a destination also changes FSDb behavior as it gets hints for the navigation path from the server about things like stops signs, lanes, etc. that aren't available to FSDb when you don't have a destination set.)

 

[sleepydoc]

I had the same FSD problem on my 2016 Model S90D and only check it on new firmware/map releases to see if Tesla fixed the issue. I understand that you should put in a destination when using FSD, but if there is no destination set, FSD should follow the lane lines and not make any turns since there is no destination to tell FSD to turn right or left to reach the destination.

It should follow the lane lines. Beyond that you really have no claim to any expectation of where it will go. If you haven’t entered a destination then you‘ve implicitly said you don’t care where it goes. Like @MP3Mike said, the issue Is your expectation, Not the software.

I'd say the main issue is your expectation of how it should work, as Tesla certainly hasn't said that without a destination set that it will just go straight.


There is no issue. I think Elon said that it tries to head towards "home" if you don't have a destination set. (Or maybe it decides on heading toward home, or work, based on time of day or distance from either.) My experience has been that it mainly goes straight until it can't and then it normally turns right if it can. But it isn't consistent.

If you want a predictable travel path set a destination. (Setting a destination also changes FSDb behavior as it gets hints for the navigation path from the server about things like stops signs, lanes, etc. that aren't available to FSDb when you don't have a destination set.)

Maybe it heads towards Tesla HQ in Austin?

 

[KLam]

I had the same FSD problem on my 2016 Model S90D and only check it on new firmware/map releases to see if Tesla fixed the issue. I understand that you should put in a destination when using FSD, but if there is no destination set, FSD should follow the lane lines and not make any turns since there is no destination to tell FSD to turn right or left to reach the destination.

The street that I test it on is Jester Blvd., it has a few curves and it is about 1.5 miles long. FSD should follow the lane lines for the entire 1.5 miles. Instead of doing this, about .4 miles into the drive, it will turn on the right blinker, make a right turn and follow a loop around to a stop sign at Jester Blvd. Since there is no destination, instead of turning right on Jester Blvd., it crosses Jester Blvd. and winds through other streets. If I cancel FSD and not let it turn right, it will go up a few blocks and turn on the left blinker and want to make a left turn. If I cancel FSD and let it continue, it will try and turn right into the neighborhood pool parking lot. If I cancel it, it will then go up a few more streets and try and make left turn. This has happened on multiple firmware and map updates. Since it happens on the same streets and pool parking lot, there is an issue with either FSD or map software.

You can solve your problem by pointing on the map and set 1.5 miles down the street as destination and navigate there.

 

[JohnB007]

I've said this multiple times already, but for those who are new to this forum - FSD allows myself and my wife to tackle trips we've never even dreamed of before. Far from disengagement free, but stress level is much much lower, even though my hands are on the wheel all the time.

There is a learning curve for sure and it gets easier more time you spend with it. If your trips are FSD friendly, there is a good chance that you will benefit quite a bit. I'm not sure if alternative systems allow usage on any roads now but that was not the case at the time when I bought my MY, and this is important to me.

 

[CaseyL]

I've said this multiple times already, but for those who are new to this forum - FSD allows myself and my wife to tackle trips we've never even dreamed of before. Far from disengagement free, but stress level is much much lower, even though my hands are on the wheel all the time.

We make a lot of road trips as well and FSD does drastically reduce the stress level. I also make a lot of business trips that are about 400 miles (one-way). These trips would completely wear me out without FSD.

 

[Pdubs]

LOL. I swear that there is some special relationship between engineers and Monty Python films. Search for the Holy Grail is my favorite, and the Meaning of Life comes in a close second.

“Whats the airspeed velocity of an unladen swallow?”

or my favorite,

”ITS JUST A FLESH WOUND”

 

[KLam]

I've said this multiple times already, but for those who are new to this forum - FSD allows myself and my wife to tackle trips we've never even dreamed of before. Far from disengagement free, but stress level is much much lower, even though my hands are on the wheel all the time.

There is a learning curve for sure and it gets easier more time you spend with it. If your trips are FSD friendly, there is a good chance that you will benefit quite a bit. I'm not sure if alternative systems allow usage on any roads now but that was not the case at the time when I bought my MY, and this is important to me.

I agree 100%. I would not know where to put my hands if not on the steering wheel, paying attention!

My most recent relaxed trip was vacation at Paso Robles wine country. One morning I drove alone (I didn't want to ride with my daughter and family because I sometime get car sick through winding mountain roads as a passenger) to San Simeon and toured the Hearst Castle. Dinner at Cambria and have to drove back to Paso Robles at night through Route 46, a somewhat winding mountain two lanes road. FSDb handled it beautifully, keeping in lane, negotiated the curves nicely with the appropriate slow downs and speed up, not bothered by the oncoming traffic headlights. If it was a few years earlier with AP, that would not have been that easy. AP would not adjust speed to take curves and would sometimes cross center line on sharp curves.